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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 07-10-2012, 12:23 PM
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teejay1980 teejay1980 is offline
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circular saw blade steel?

A friend of mine is gonna give me a 5' diameter circular saw blade its pretty old he has had it for quite some time and I was wondering what the chances are its L-6 and how I could find out?
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:45 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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The chances are pretty low. To find out, send a sample of the steel to a lab for analysis. For a couple hundred bucks you'll be able to find out if you have $2 worth of L6.

You can, of course, go through the process of testing the steel yourself to find out if it hardens enough to be useful as a blade but if you only have one of the saw blades it's hardly worth the effort and expense, especially if it doesn't work out which it almost certainly will not.

If the blade has carbide tips then it definitely isn't blade steel....


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Old 07-10-2012, 01:11 PM
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I don't know if it has carbide teeth or not but ill check it out. Is it only the saw mill band saw blades that are made from L6 and not the circular saws?
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Old 07-10-2012, 02:20 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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No, what it is is that there is no way to know for sure what you have so don't waste your time with it and that includes saw mill bandsaw blades. Good blade steel costs only a few dollars and comes fully annealed (soft), straight, and clean. With known blade steel you know what heat treat process is appropriate to get the best results from the steel. From mystery metal - especially small circular saw blades - all you're likely to get is a convenient way to waste your time and money .

Leave the salvaged steel for later after you've had time to learn the basic processes of heat treating different metals. You'll find that much easier to learn if you start out knowing what metal you have ....


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Old 07-10-2012, 04:32 PM
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Ok thanks for the info ill just put it in the garage until I get some more experience. Oh and is a 5 foot circular saw blade small do they come bigger?
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:05 PM
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OK, I misread that. Ya, they do come bigger and that blade has a fighting chance of being good for knives. BUT, not all those blades are L6, some are 15N20 and some are who knows what and some are surely not usable (these are the ones with carbide teeth). So, even though the odds have improved for this saw blade I'd still suggest you put it aside until you've mastered the basics of making and heat treating a blade. That way, you'll know what is supposed to happen when you do each step and can tell if something isn't going right. Right now you'd wouldn't know if things were right or not and neither would we ....


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Old 07-10-2012, 05:23 PM
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Yep that's my plan for now since its free ill just throw it in the garage and wait till I get more experience If it doesn't have the carbide teeth that is. Thanks again for the advice.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:13 PM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Originally Posted by teejay1980 View Post
Yep that's my plan for now since its free ill just throw it in the garage and wait till I get more experience If it doesn't have the carbide teeth that is. Thanks again for the advice.
Those big saw blades sell for pretty good money around here. A while ago I was thinkin of getting one but the price was crazy! $200 for a 5' "l6" sawmill blade... I have a few throwing knive blanks that are the sawmill "l6" steel. As soon as my forge us setup in going to experiment with them.
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Old 07-11-2012, 11:10 PM
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For a lot less than that price AND a lot less effort you can buy all the L6 you'd ever want already annealed, straight and clean ...


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Old 07-12-2012, 08:05 AM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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For a lot less than that price AND a lot less effort you can buy all the L6 you'd ever want already annealed, straight and clean ...
And to top it off there are other steels that are more heat treat friendly and perform just as well for the same price or less.
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Old 07-12-2012, 04:05 PM
Jason Fry Jason Fry is offline
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You have roughly 2827 square inches of steel that might be usable. For $50 or so you can send off one square inch and have it tested. After that, you'll have 2826 square inches of known steel. That equals about 235 feet of 1" bar stock. It still may not be suitable for a knife, but you will know for sure what you have.

The saw blade I had tested turned out to be 8670M, a suitable knife steel. You pay your money and take your chances. Or you could sell it to somebody who wants a saw blade, as suggested, and buy bar stock.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:54 PM
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Yeah ill just hang onto it for now might have it tested later on it doesn't take up much space against the garage wall and it was free.
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Old 07-13-2012, 01:36 AM
metal99 metal99 is offline
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Yeah ill just hang onto it for now might have it tested later on it doesn't take up much space against the garage wall and it was free.
Just test it yourself. Heat to above critical,soak for a little and water quench it. After you do that bust it with a hammer and see how fine the grain is. If it looks good do the same thing with warm oil and break it. If that still looks good then your golden. The only testing I would consider getting done would be some hardness testing just so you can figure out what a good tempering temp would be. You can even determine that yourself if you want by doing some samples at different temps and destroying them. It will give you a good idea on what hardness/toughness the steel performs best at. Just my 2cents. Even if you do get it tested all your going to find out is what alloys are in it not the carbon content. Sure the alloys change what heat treat is needed but as long as you have time to do some tests yourself you should be fine. Make a rough blade and put it to the test.

Or buy some steel and your set lol. I'm the "I can make this work" kinda guy. My first knife was made with mystery steel and NO knife making knowledge to speak of. I just kept playing around with heat treating till I got what I wanted then I went ahead and forged the blade on a vice with an O/A torch. If you have the time and ambition you can figure things out fairly well. Sure you may not know the exact science of what that steel alloy is actually doing but you'll know if it will make a good blade or not.

Not trying to sound like an armchair expert here but I do have a fair bit of heat treating experience, my Dad has tought me a lot about metal through the years and I have made quite a few pry bars, chisels and punches from drill rod and spring steels like 5160. Dad has also made his fair share of gun springs for people as well as "extending" worn out revolver hammers and re heat treating them.

Last edited by metal99; 07-13-2012 at 01:42 AM.
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Old 07-13-2012, 10:49 AM
Doug Lester Doug Lester is online now
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Admittedly, that could be done but, given the option, I'd still send it off. Actually, I might be able to get the testing done at the local Fastenal store. I've done the water quench test too on a piece of mystery metal and it's taken a lot not to make a knife out of that 6' piece of 1" rebar but, so far, I've resisted.

The problem with that test is that you only learn that you have enough carbon in it to quench harden enough to take an edge of some quality, or not. No idea if it's eutectic, hypo, or hypereutictic. That does effect proper austinization for quenching. No idea of what the as quenched hardness is which would help determine the tempering temperature. A little gadget to measure hardness of steel in sections as thin as a knife blade can set you back $1-2K. Then there's all the things that alloying elements can do. Effect depth of hardening, hardness-a similar factor but different, wear resistance, strength, toughness, and a bunch of other stuff. If I had a good amount of an unknown steel that I was at least reasonably certain was the same I would start out with a water quench, just to see if it were worth bothering with, then send in a sample to see what I actually had. A little less stumbling around in the dark. Things can get tricky enough going from one batch of steel to the next without an exact assay. Especially with stuff like W series steels.

Of course, changing mystery metal into a known steel does also change it from a found steel that cost you nothing into a steel that cost you something and does away with the romance of working with an unknown steel. Still, if you have enough that should be the same as with a leaf spring assembly, the testing could be very much worth while.

Doug


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