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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 12-19-2014, 10:13 AM
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Naboyle Naboyle is offline
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What does everyone think of these file guides?

So I need to get a file guide. I hear nothing but good things about uncle Al's carbide file guides. They're pricey thou. Well I found these ones but being made from aluminum has me worried as to how strong they are. What's everyone think?

http://www.billbehnkeknives.com/available_items.html
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  #2  
Old 12-19-2014, 10:43 AM
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Hunter10139 Hunter10139 is offline
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Well, I don't really use file guides but here's my input. First, I wouldn't think they'd see much force, so strength isn't an issue. The carbide pieces on the side will prevent any file damaging the aluminum too. I'm sure these work just fine, but $75.00? You could probably stop by a home depot, lowes, or fastenol to get the pins and 1/4-20 socket caps for a few dollars. Then you could make the blocks out of some hardwood you can easily find(or already have) and just use nuts in place of the threads on the aluminum. Finally, just harden a couple strips of high carbon steel(1084, 1095, etc. and don't temper) and glue them to the sides of the hardwood. Boom, you probably just spent no more than $20 and have some file guides.

Of course this is just the idea of someone who doesn't use them so you might want to wait for other people's response. I'd just hate to see you spend money on something you might be able to make easily.


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  #3  
Old 12-19-2014, 11:25 AM
samuraistuart samuraistuart is offline
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Most of the carbide file guides are kinda pricey. If you make your own, please temper it. Slightly, if nothing else.

I made a set from W2, 4" long, with the screws close to the ends. A little torque and she snapped in half. I didn't temper them...straight out of quench. Made another set and tempered at 350F. They'll bend quite a bit now.

The problem with homemade jobs is if you don't have aligning pins incorporated into the design, the two screws are not enough to cause it to align perfectly every time. Oh it is VERY VERY close, don't get me wrong. I think with two screws and two pins, like the pro made ones with carbide faces, will give much more precision.

I personally cannot justify the cost of carbide faced guides. A good carbon steel with low temp temper will work very well indeed, and does for me. Of course, I am using files to cut bevels so I am not too concerned about the safe side of the file eating into the guide face at all. Using a grinder(2x72 or such) might cut into the faces of a hardened steel guide much faster than carbide if you're not careful, but certainly doable.

Last edited by samuraistuart; 12-19-2014 at 11:31 AM.
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  #4  
Old 12-19-2014, 12:33 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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About the only time I use file guides is when I'm trying to do a dagger blade. I made my guides from O1, fully hardened, no temper. Some steels can handle being used at full hardness, some cannot and, frankly, it doesn't matter if you temper them a little bit because file guides don't really need to be all that hard. Seriously, if you could make file guides out of industrial diamond a fresh 60 grit ceramic belt could still cut into it, especially over time.

So, just get some 1084 or whatever you like to use for blade steel and make your own. Make them just like those on the Behnke site, you can include the pins or not, temper a bit for 1084. I figure the couple thou difference the pins might make hardly matter as I wobble more than that when I work. It takes about an hour to make a set and, if you are careful, you can make many knives with them before you need another set.

There are things we must spend big bucks on and then there are things that we should do for ourselves. Knowing the difference is how guys like me (with no money) can afford the expensive toys ....


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  #5  
Old 12-19-2014, 01:17 PM
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DanCom DanCom is offline
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Good advice Ray.

Or you could make them out of cocobolo and your belt won't cut on that side after a quarter second. Better then Teflon!



Happy Holidays!
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  #6  
Old 12-20-2014, 05:43 AM
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Crex Crex is offline
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Think of it this way - making knives you deal with compound angles and shapes, drilling, tapping threads, working hard to get tight fits and finishes, thermal cycling steels to get correct hardness, etc.
The file guides are simple straight forward - square up, drill, tap, harden......why would you not make your own?


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  #7  
Old 12-21-2014, 12:27 AM
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Naboyle Naboyle is offline
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Guess I hadn't thought of making my own. I don't have anything thick enough so I'll have to order some. I was thinking they'd need to be more precise. I don't have a surface grinder or anything.
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Old 12-21-2014, 05:21 AM
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???How do you establish true flats on your blades?
Hand tools - files and sandpaper - have been doing this ever since flat surfaces were determined to be necessary. Sure, a surface grinder or milling machine are great for this, but not at all necessary. Patience and proper practice with determination are all that are needed. Draw file to flat and finish up on a sanding plate/surface. No biggie there.
Source of materials - buy if you like, trade here on KNF for some thicker stock, go to a Suspension/Muffler shop and barter a few drops (scrap cut-offs) of big truck spring. Anneal it if not already "soft". You can HT later as described above.
Tip - if you can get the chunk big enough, pre-drill your pilot pin holes and bolt holes prior to splitting the piece. That way you know they will be aligned.

Think on it, sleep on it, think on it a bit more then just do a couple. You will see how simple, quick and easy a lot of these shop tools are to make and use compared to making a knife.


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  #9  
Old 12-21-2014, 09:28 AM
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DanCom DanCom is offline
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Along with what Carl said. If you can turn a piece of steel into a reasonable knife, you are capable of making just about any tool or jig that you need in your own shop.

I learned at a young age from my Dad who is a retired cabinet maker and locksmith. He did piles of things that involved various kinds of jigs, forms or purpose-built tools. And wow, he made them all in his shop.

Don't be afraid to experiment with jigs. Only you have to know.

Merry Christmas!

Dan

Last edited by DanCom; 12-21-2014 at 09:29 AM. Reason: of not for
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  #10  
Old 12-21-2014, 10:43 AM
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Naboyle Naboyle is offline
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Musta had a brain fart or something. I didn't even think of it being that easy. I tend to over complicate things! Thanks for all the suggestions guys.
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  #11  
Old 12-21-2014, 11:49 PM
tim37 tim37 is offline
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I use the stainless steel with carbide faces ones made by Bruce Bump. A little expensive, yes, but cheap if your time is worth anything. The carbon steel ones rust after being dipped in water when cooling the blade.

Last edited by tim37; 12-21-2014 at 11:50 PM. Reason: add something
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  #12  
Old 12-24-2014, 07:45 AM
DaveL DaveL is offline
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I have had these for years but mine are made out of D2 steel and heat treated and really pretty nice.
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  #13  
Old 12-27-2014, 09:03 PM
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C Craft C Craft is offline
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Make your own! They don't have to be made of some fancy steel with fancy HT!

KISS - Keep it simple stupid

I made mine of mild steel, and drilled tiny holes in the face and then JB Welded a set of carbide strips on the face.

I had a set that another blade maker had made and HTed and charged well for. Never used them they laid around the shop for a while, (over a year). One day I clamped them on a blade tightened it down and walked to the other side of the shop and hear a tink!
I emailed the guy that made them and he proceeds to tell me I must have overtightened them. Sure is that what you tell your customers about your knives as well!

Then it hits me. If I am not filing or grinding against the metal the guide is made of why the he!! does it have to be a hard steel or for that matter HTed! It doesn't, plain and simple. And I don't have to worry about snapping one because of over tightening! The worst I can do is strip out the screws!
The carbide strips are the most expensive part of them. I bought them from ENCO or MCS. I have used this set on the grinder and the carbide strips keep them from being eat up. So the KISS theory works again!!!!

Here are some pics of the guide I made. I bought the square stock at the local hardware. Then I heated the square stock and bent it in the shape it is in. They resemble some made by another maker. The shape gives you something to hang onto at the grinder.







Here is a link to the carbide strips.
http://www.msdiscount.com/columnar.a...ssioncookieset


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If I capture those three factors in each knife I build, I am assured the knife will become a piece that is used and treasured by its owner!

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Last edited by C Craft; 12-27-2014 at 09:13 PM.
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1084, 1095, advice, belt, blade, carbon, design, diamond, drill, file, glue, handle, harden, home, homemade, knife, knives, made, make, make your own, making, pins, problem, steel, temper


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