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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 12-10-2013, 10:14 AM
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hondo76 hondo76 is offline
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Easy to HT steel other than 1084?

I have been looking all over and i can not find any 1084 anywhere it is all i have heat treated and know the recipe and have done a few. but now i have a KMG and a knife dog HT oven made by paragon on the way to my shop but i'm almost out of steel so what would be my next best option on steel?
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Old 12-10-2013, 10:56 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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If you will be heat treating in your Paragon then you can use most anything you like. O1 and 440C have straight forward HT processes and are probably about the least expensive steels after 1084. If you want other simple carbon steels you could look for 1080 or 1075 which HT exactly the same as 1084. But, as long as you have the Paragon I would suggest trying O1 for carbon steel blades and 440C for stainless....


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Old 12-10-2013, 11:11 AM
Pairomedicsfish Pairomedicsfish is offline
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Good info Ray....with 440c, is cryo mandatory? can you do it well enough with dry ice?
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Old 12-10-2013, 11:28 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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Cryo is not mandatory but 440C does react well to cryo so do it if you can. Although I've never used the dry ice method it is my understanding that dry ice in a kerosene or diesel fuel bath does work well enough to have a beneficial effect.

To use cryo of any type you first HT your blade, temper your blade once, then do the cryo (an hour or two is probably enough but I like to leave mine over night), then temper at least one more time. To be perfectly clear: the blade goes in the cryo only when the steel is as cool as you can get it (room temp or less) and then it goes in slowly so as not to shock the steel. Cryo is not a quench - never put hot steel into any type of cryo process .

Some steels benefit a lot from cryo, some a little and some not at all but cryo never hurts the steel so I do it on all my blades just because I can ...


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Old 12-10-2013, 11:30 AM
Pairomedicsfish Pairomedicsfish is offline
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Thank you very much! Crystal clear information....carry on....
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Old 12-10-2013, 12:59 PM
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hondo76 hondo76 is offline
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ok thanks ray i will look into some 0-1 thanks for the info!
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Old 12-10-2013, 01:23 PM
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hondo76 hondo76 is offline
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Hey ray what would be your routine for a HT O-1?
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Old 12-10-2013, 03:23 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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First off, with any steel that you plan to use the first thing you should do is get a spec sheet on that steel. This is easy to do as all the manufacturers have these sheets online for each steel they make. alphaknifesupply.com is also a good, fast source for these sheets for most of the steel they sell. These sheets describe the annealing, normalizing, and heat treat requirements of the steel and are the natural starting point for your process. Often, they are all you need but sometimes you can try a variation on the process that some other maker swears is the best ever way to HT that steel. He might be right or he might be off his noodle but the spec sheets will always work whether they are the 'best' formula or not (and I think they usually are).

I use the sheet, so I pre-heat at 1200 F for 5 minutes, then raise to 1475 F (or 1550 F, can't remember, check the sheet) for 10 minutes. I quench in Tough Quench but Parks 50 would be just as good and canola or similar would also give adequate results. I like to cryo O1 because I think it helps but that isn't a factory recommendation. Temper in the 425 F (adjust according to your desired result) range for one hour, twice...


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Old 12-10-2013, 05:41 PM
jmccustomknives jmccustomknives is offline
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5160 is about as forgiving a steel as they come. After that L-6. And in my opinion L-6 will out perform 1084 in all aspects. Just my opinion.
L-6 however will not show a hammon. In that 1084 or some other simple carbon steel is mandatory. One can be coaxed out of 5160, but it's a little tricky.
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Old 12-10-2013, 07:26 PM
mitchmountain mitchmountain is offline
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Anyone else use cruforge V, I got it from Alpha knife supply and its easy to treat and a great steel when finished.

MM
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Old 12-10-2013, 07:57 PM
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It's a great steel and probably within the ability of a newbie. But, it is a little more expensive than 1084 or 1080 and it isn't always available in thicknesses that are desirable for stock removal (Cruforge V was design for forging). Those are the reasons why we don't recommend it but if you have a little experience at forging under your belt and you don't mind the extra money Cruforge V is an excellent steel when you are ready to move up ...


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1084, 440c, 5160, 550, bee, blade, blades, carbon, easy, forging, heat, heat treat, hot, knife, knife supply, made, make, newbie, o-1, simple, stainless, steel, supply, temper


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