hammer foundation

[birdog4]

Looking for info/direction into pouring a pad for a hammer. Size, depth, rebar?, etc.
This 50# Fairbanks that followed me home grosses out at nearly a ton.
Concrete with rubber pad? concrete with timbers?
Timbers alone? Thanks bruce

[Geno]

Timbers for the vibration factor.
Sorry it took so long, I was out of town shooting again.

[ragnik]

Bruce,

Just drive that hammer to me here in eastern PA and then I will worry about mounting it.

I am still voting for timber

Ross

[Will]

Anybody got a pic or diagram? I was thinking bolt it to a concreat foundation, say about a foot thick.

[CWKnifeman]

If you contact Chris Marks at www.marksforge.com he should be able to help you out with this one. If not he will know who exactly to talk to about it. Tell him that Curtis said hello.
Curtis Wilson

[Ed Caffrey]

The recommended concrete base for a 50lb hammer goes like this.....

3' deep X 4' long X 3' wide, with rebar every 6" in a grid pattern. (both horizontal and vertical)

A simpler way that will spread the stress out....

RR ties, placed edge to edge and bolted together with a long piece of 1/2"-3/4" round bar, threaded on each end and washers/nuts. 3' wide X about 4' long works well IF you have a reenforced concrete floor of at least 4". If the floor is less than 4" thick make the RR tie platform larger to spread out the stress, otherwise the hammer will eventually turn the floor to dust. Once you have the platform built, you can use large piece of angle iron to bolt the base to the floor, and then once the hammer is in place, bolt it to the base. I've operated a 25lb and 50lb hammer in this manner for many years without problems.

[Ed Fowler]

Be sure to use some pad between the hammer and floor. I used some old belting, works well. The more solid your mount, the better your hammer will work. My 50 pound hammers were mounted on 6" concrete floor with a plywood base for years, worked great. Now they are bolted down to heavier concrete floor with belting and work better. Good Luck and enjoy!

[birdog4]

Thanks guys. My biggest concern was the unstable soil beneath my forge shop.Topsoil and sandy clay. I was worried that it just might pound itself into the ground.
Ed, I know the specs for the LG call for a huge chunk of concrete. Hoped to avoid that.
There were some pictures posted over at ForgeMagic of a 200# Chambersburg mounted on RR ties that was demoed at hte JohnDeere HammerIn a few weeks ago.
I had kinda thought that having a foot of concrete, 3'x4', then 1/2" mine belting, and a flat of 4x6 timbers set on edge. I have some 1" allthread to use as studs(anchored in the concrete)
Thanks again fellas. And Ross, that ain't gonna happen :-)

[ragnik]

Cant blame a fella for trying

Ross

[Mike Krall]

This is probably too late.

Holler at Keri and Sid at Little Giant. Keri sent me copies of a Fairbanks brochure and there is a picture with foundation specs for each weight. The thing that is nice about a Fairbanks is the blow comes on the anvil and not the machine-base/frame so the foundation doesn't need to be huge.

The numbers for a 50# Fairbanks are for two foundation parts. A concrete base of 12" slightly bigger than the machine-base with sloped corners and 7/8" bolts anchored in it at 24"x16 1/4" (spacing of holes in machine base). The 7/8" bolts come through a 10" wood top piece 2 3/4". The wood top piece is 32"x23". The picture shows two 10"x11 1/2" with a square hole on the centerline starting 3 1/2" back from the front edge. The square cut out is 10"x14" and oriented as the anvil is. This hole is filled by a 10"x14" so the anvil sits on end grain. The top piece is bolted together with four through bolts, side to side, top and bottom, positioned slightly inside the hold down bolts.

If you have bad soil but can dig a little and can get a piece of separation cloth (geotextile... can be found at dirt work outfits), you can fix that. Dig an extra 10" to 12" and over size two or three feet, lay in the separation cloth, backfill with road base (3/4" minus) in 3" lifts and pack. put your base on top of this.

After all of that yapping, Jerry Rados has a 500# hammer and it sits on two layers of RR ties that are through bolted and bolted together with the hammer bolted to it. All of this is layed in level with the dirt floor. Jerry told me it works fine.

[birdog4]

No, not too late, Mike.
Here's what I decided on. 4x4x3 foot deep hole. Gonna crisscross RR ties up to grade, sheet of plywood to make everything even, 1/2" thick minebelting for cushion. Sound reasonable?
Played with the idea of a 1" steel plate under the machine itself. Thanks bruce

[Mike Krall]

Sorry Bruce, I went to sleep on you...

If you are talking layers of RR ties stacked tight side to side, I'd figure your plan was way stout enough. Two layers of ties at 4' x 4' would probably be fine as long as they were about 100% bedded. Three layers might not be too much but more layers than that would (opinions are like noses...). If the layers are through bolted, side to side and have machine base bolts going clean to the bottom (with stought washers), it ought to act like one solid piece.

I've seen hammers on conveyor belt before. They seem to act fine. None of the industrial pictures I've seen show cushioning. I think cushioning must reduce the power of the blow but I don't know how much. It might be cushioning on a concrete floor (not a separated hammer base) reduces the shock wave in the floor and maybe that is something a person would want.

Maybe a thing to think about is Fairbanks using a piece of end grain under the anvil. Most other hammers spread the blows over a lot larger area. On a three layer (or more if decided) maybe a good piece of end grain could be worked into the top layer.

[birdog4]

Mike, I ended up with 3 layers of bridge ties, crisscrossed and below ground level. The top layer is 8"x8"x4' white ash bolted together and pinned into the top layer of ties. It too is partially below grade. Should make for good impact resistance.
I got ahold of the Fairbanks specs and saw the wood requirements.
Put the fromnt together lasty weekend, have the linkage to do this week. Thanks bruce

[birdog4]

Mike, I ended up with 3 layers of bridge ties, crisscrossed and below ground level. The top layer is 8"x8"x4' white ash bolted together and pinned into the top layer of ties. It too is partially below grade. Should make for good impact resistance.
I got ahold of the Fairbanks specs and saw the wood requirements.
Put the front together last weekend, have the linkage to do this week. Thanks bruce

[Mike Krall]

The foundation sounds hell-fer-stout

Boy I wish I could move along on my #50 Fairbanks like you are moving on yours. I've got steel coming for dies and an anvil block (was missing). The motor is cooked so I'm looking for a 1750 TEFC 3hp. Some of the linkage is missing and all the pictures in the stuff Sid and Keri sent always shows the wrong side. Do you have pictures of your linkage? Are you running a flat belt? If so, what diameter is is the motor pulley? I'm asking because the one on this motor is an "after market" and after seeing some of the other cobble work on this hammer, I wouldn't doubt the last owners used what they could get instead of what the hammer needed.

Mike