Who does the heat treating for you?

[alexkuzn]

Guys, who do you recommend for heat treating?
What is a reasonable price for HT?

Thanks,
Alex

[Ray Rogers]

Depends on what you are heat treating. If your blades are carbon steel then you should try to heat treat them yourself (plenty of info on how to do that in older threads). I don't know of any professional service that will HT carbon blades but you might find a maker who's willing to do it for you.

If your blades are stainless then Texas Knifemakers is a good place to start. They will do single blades for just a few dollars. If you make your blades in large batches of 20 or more then Paul Bos is the choice of many of the full time makers....

[Todd Robbins]

Alex

Paul Bos will heat treat any air hardening steel blade. I think he charges 15$ per blade up to 75$. He'll heat treat a whole bunch for 75$. I can't remember if there's a limit, but you can get his services for 2$ or 3$ per blade, if you send enough. Even at 15$ per blade, the confidence gained from sending your blade to the best there is is worth the money. If you plan on selling your knives, being heat treated by Bos can add to the saleability and price you can charge for each knife. Also, he prides himself on never sending a blade back to a customer that isn't straight. If it warps, he straightens it. He's also a true class act to deal with.

You can find out how to heat treat your own carbon steel blades here. Try a search for "heat treating ___" filling the blank with whatever steel you're using.

Todd

[Jeremy Krammes]

I have been using Paul Bos lately for my S-30-V blades. It's $14.00 per blade up to 20 blades. That price also includes cryo. Turnaround time is about two weeks. A great guy to deal with. You can contact him through Bucks website. Just look for his name in blue on the main page. http://www.buckknives.com/

Jeremy

[alexkuzn]

I found lots of info on heat treating. But not a single source says how to measure steel temperature. (Magnet method don't count)
So how do you guys tell temperature of the steel?

[Ray Rogers]

Perhaps if you could give us some hint about what type of steel you're trying to heat treat we would be better able to answer your question....

[alexkuzn]

It's O-1 steel

[Ray Rogers]

O-1, being a carbon steel, can be hardened at a relatively low temperature, around 1500 F. There are markers called Tempil Sticks that can be used to mark carbon steel. According to which stick you choose to mark with you will see the mark melt when a certain temperature is reached. The problem with this method in our case is that carbon steels are often heat treated in open fires (like forges) which can allow the paint to melt too soon if direct flame is allowed to contact it.

There are also 'cones' which are a common way to measure temperature in a kiln. A particular cone will melt and bend over when a particular temperature is reached. Again, the cone must be protected from direct flame to get an accurate result.

Obviously, the temperature can be meaured with a thermocouple or a laser style thermometer but if you had access to those I don't suppose you'd be asking the question.

There are charts of colors by which you supposedly can judge the temperature of a piece of steel. In my opinion, they may be of use to an expert who is extremely familiar with the particular steel he is working with and who can GUARANTEE that the conditins under which the color is being judged is always consistant but for the rest of us steel color can only provide a rough guestimate of temperature.

Finally, you mentioned a magnet but rejected the idea for some reason you did not state. You also didn't say why you want to know the temperature so I have to make some guesses here and if I miss the mark feel free to ignore my comments. If you are trying to harden the O-1 then my recomendation is use the magnet. It doesn't matter what the exact temperaure is, when the steel is non-magnetic it's ready to quench. If you are trying to temper the steel none of the methods except a thermometer will work for temperatures that low.

If you are trying to find the welding temperature just touch the hot steel with a metal coat hanger. When the hanger stocks to the O-1 it is ready to weld.

If none of those guesse does you any good, you may just have to break down and tell us what it is you are trying to accomplish and what methods, tools, and materials you are trying to use to get the job done.....

[alexkuzn]

Sorry I weren't clear enough. All I need is to heat treat a blade 1/8" think I am going to make from O-1. I just got an impression that I need to know exact temperature for heat treating. If I don't it's even better. Magnet method rules!

[Pep]

May want to check out Jerry Rados (sp?).
I believe he does Air, oil, and all.
Not to mention makes some of the best Damascus around.
I think you could trust Jerry's talent for just about any service available.

[alexkuzn]

BTW I don't have any special heat treating equipment and going to make some simple setup and use open flame torch for heat source.

[Ray Rogers]

Right, it's not necessary to know the exact temperature with carbon steel as the magnet will tell you what you need to know. There is a bit of a trick to it, however.

The trick is that you want to quench the steel just as it becomes non-magnetic, or very shortly after. You will have to test the steel often as it heats up so that you know just when the change occurs. The magnet will have to touch the steel often in order to do this but you cannot just leave the magnet stuck to the steel and wait for it to fall off. The heat will ruin the magnet very quickly if it's allowed to get that hot...

[Todd Robbins]

I use the magnet for determining temps for annealling, normallizing, and quenching. It has worked really well for me. When I first got started, I used the old "heat to cherry red, then..." method. I learned rapidly that my quality control was terrible, as "cherry red" temperature changes tremendously, depending on the lighting. I learned about using a magnet from Wayne Goddard's first book, The Wonder of Knifemaking.

Tempil sticks can work, as can the cones, but the magnet seems to be the guage of choice.

Todd