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Historical Inspiration This forum is dedicated to the discussion of historical knife design and its influence on modern custom knife work.

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Old 02-12-2010, 06:41 AM
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Looking for period correct for 1533

Morning all,

I have had a member of another forum approach me to make him a period correct piece for his Ren gear. He's looking for a hunter or (for lack of a better term) EDC dagger for around the year 1533. Don't have much detail outside of "mercenary/huntsman" but I'm willing to bet that it would be man English and a "common" man social level.

I would guess that a seax for a knife category and bullock or rondel for the dagger fits the bill here but does anyone else have a recommendations?

Thanks,
Jim


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Old 02-12-2010, 08:28 AM
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I think a seax might be a little old for that time period.

By 1533 the Crusades had come and gone. English royals who participated have travelled to Europe and Asia Minor, many bringing back items and arms and influences from throughout Europe and Persia.

By this time there was also some significant political interaction with Germany, so you might look into the German hunting "hangers or hangars" like this one at the Art Institute of Chicago: http://www.artic.edu/aic/collections/artwork/117131.

The person's persona is likely going to drive what they carry. I think that for "mercenary or huntsman" this person is going to be of elevated (though not of the highest) status. Not a common man. Think favored third cousin to the duke who has no shot at the throne, but has a little money and influence and isn't afraid to do some dirty work to keep things that way. It will be better quality and design than a common man's kitchen/butcher knife but not as ornate as something a knight or prince would carry.
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Old 02-12-2010, 09:30 AM
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That maybe a bit out of my skill range.

Ok, that's way out of my skill range!!!

I did find this using the search perimeters you suggested



15th century Ballock

Jim


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Old 02-12-2010, 10:13 AM
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Went through a few more searches and came up with some interesting history pieces.

Navaja seem to be dated back to the 15th century. Various scandies have been (and are still) used through that time period.

I PM'd him back to get more details.

Jim


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Old 02-12-2010, 10:14 AM
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It's actually not that bad. Did you read the notes? Blade is dated 1534, but appears to be rehandled/hilt added late 1600's. So, somebody decided to take great-great-great grandpop's hunting knife and fancy it up for the family keepsake.

As long as you avoid the fru-fru stuff and do a simple interpretation of the handle (maybe slip on a double guard, then do a mortised or framed handle), the blade isn't that bad.
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Old 02-12-2010, 10:19 AM
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Mortised I know but you've lost me on double guard and framed handle.

Actually while I know what a mortised handle is I'm not sure how you mean to apply it here. Do you mean to do a mortised handle of wood and than wire wrap it with a pommel nut?

Jim


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Old 02-12-2010, 11:41 AM
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I was thinking bowie when I mentioned the double guard, extending above and below the handle. If the guy plans to wear/carry the knife at re-enactment events/SCA, many places don't allow a double edged blade.

If you're going to do a pommel and nut then I'd just do a complete hidden tang and drill out the handle block. Hadn't even thought of a wire wrap.

My idea for a mortised/framed tang was to do the blade as a hidden tang, so that you could slip the guard over the tang. Then, doing a fileworked frame (think false full tang, a piece of steel or brass that fits over the tang from the back, behind the guard and sandwiching it in place. Then, pin handle slabs over the tang and frame, so that it looks like a full tang.

Here's a WIP thread on a Loveless hunter with framed handle: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=607967
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Old 02-12-2010, 11:57 AM
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Interesting. I like it. It's a lot like the coke bottle handle tutorial.

I'll have to look though. I don't think that full tangs are PC for the 16th century. I think that the first common use was the 17th.

On the double edge, that will be the customer's call on that. A lot of Ren fairs don't allow any weapons. Most that do require peace ties. The main issue would be more of the states laws on the double edge but, again, I'll leave that to the customer with a little reminder about the carry issues.

Jim


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Old 02-12-2010, 12:00 PM
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By the way check out this -

http://www.myarmoury.com/feature_spot_bd.html

Quite a collection of pics.


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