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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #1  
Old 09-04-2001, 03:05 PM
SIGGI
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What tools in what order


As one of the new guys, I am very tool short. In building a wish list, could you more experienced makers shed some light on tools that give the biggest bang for the buck and possibly when to spend more and where to spend less.

Thanks again for all your input.


Bob Sigmon
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  #2  
Old 09-04-2001, 03:29 PM
Bob Warner
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Hello SIGGI, welcome to the CKD. This question is asked quite a bit around here as well as a few others. Here is an answer I posted before for some other new people. It has more info than your request but I'm sure you will find some of it useful.

Here is some information I think all new people could appreciate.

OK, get ready, there is a LOT of info here.

Here is some useful information. Probably more information than you can digest over a few months.

If I were to start out today, knowing what I know now, I would do the following:

Look for a LOCAL blacksmithing club. You can probably go to a few of their meetings without joining but the
sign-up fee is usually cheap. These people usually have their meetings at someone's shop and put on
demonstrations. This is really the BEST place to learn next to being invited to a BLADESMITHS shop. These
people are VERY willing to teach you how to do things. They are not knifemakers (usually) but they do know
steel and how to move it around.

I learned about forging from blacksmiths and about heat treating from a heat treating place that did my early
knives. These people will teach you a lot. Some of the suppliers like Jantz will give you heat treating
information in their catalogs but I would trust the CKD when that time comes. When you are ready to heat treat
something, come back and we will assist.

I would get the following tools in this order:

First set of tools -
Safety glasses
Respirator.
Small Drill press.
8" grinder (remove wheels and put buffing wheels on it).
Files of all sizes and shapes. You can't have too many files. Use golf balls for the handles, just drill a hole and
bang it on.
A solid vise.
Some method of marking your knives with your name. At stamp, electro-etch or even a vibrating tool.
Sandpaper of all grits down to about 1500 to 2000.

This will get you through the creation of knives by filing the knife to shape.


Second set of tools -
Metal cutting band saw
Belt grinder


Now you're making knives.

OK, here is where you need to decide how serious you will be. If you plan on making knives for a long time
(not just 10 or 12 and give it up).

A good band saw is 500-$1000 bucks
A belt grinder is $1500 approximately.
A forge is cheap but a lot of work to make (mine was about $50) , or expensive if bought.
An anvil is about $1.50 to $3.00 per pound and you will want at least 100# if your a moose like me.
You can make a grinder with some effort and planning, there is help on the tooltime with Geno Osborn forum.


For the REAL SERIOUS -
Hydraulic press, speed up making damascus
surface grinder, gets stuff flat
anodizer coloring titamium
heat treat oven, or use your forge if you have one, some have both
tempering oven (use the one in the house),
cryogenic treatment station, part of the heat treating process.
acid etching station, for etching damascus
gold plating station, if you want to get fancy
a bluing station, if you think you would want to blue your stuff
mini metal lathe, for making parts
milling machine, to do the stuff I can't do
electroetching station, for putting on your mark
photo transfer station, to make your own stencils

Lots of stuff to learn.

Browse through this stuff and you will see that this can get complicated if you let it. You can make knives
simply and functional or very artsy and still functional. I would do stock removal (grinding your own blades from
flat stock), then to forging, then to making damascus, then to pattern welded damascus (where you control the
designs in the steel, real cool).

Just follow the links below and you will find a LOT of information.

Feel free to ask questions,

Bob

The first two books are great.

r1.us.rmi.yahoo.com/rmi/h...ake+knives

There is probably no place to get more information and tips than from this guy. He passed away a while back
but his family kept the page up in his memory and to satisfy all of the requests to do so. Check out EVERY
part of this page, there is not enough time in your working life for you to learn everything by trial and error.
www.engnath.com or www.knives.com/engnath.html

If you want to pound steel, here is a page about gas fired forges. The web page by Ron Reil is full of great
information. I recommend a mini mongo burner.
www.webpak.net/~rreil/design.html

This is the link to how to build the freon tank forge. This is similar to what I made but mine is bigger and more
heavy duty (I also have a small one). This would get you going for over a year of regular use before you had to
rebuild it or make a new one.
www.webpak.net/~rreil/minifor.htm

This place sells everything. It is like Grainger but has a lot more stuff. It is great for tools and screws, etc....
Order their catalog, it is free and HUGE. I suggest calling them to order and ask for the book on CD also. If
you order through the web it may not show up (mine didn't). Not really a knife store but WAY COOL.
www.mscdirect.com/

This is a gunsmithing place. There are some parts you can get from here. If you call them and tell them you
are a knifemaker, they will consider you a dealer and you will get discount pricing. Get their book and ask
them for a dealer account. They will explain how to determine your discount by sending you a paper with the
book.
www.brownells.com/Index.html

This guy can make #### near anything. You may be able to get him to make it cheaper than ordering it from
a knife supply store.
www.geocities.com/beaumon...price.html

This is a list of stuff and the type of steel it is made from. Great for starting out blacksmithing. I buy new steels
to guarantee what I am getting.
www.geocities.com/beaumon...price.html

Knifemaking supplies and tools.
www.riversidemachine.net/...tCat0.ivnu

Knifemaking supplies and tools.
If you just ask for a catalog, they will charge you. If they think you will really become a customer they will
give you the catalog, especially if you order something. This is true with just about all companies.
www.jantzsupply.com/

These people have a good variety and their prices are pretty good. You can download their catalog or call
and get one.
www.knifeandgun.com/

These people have a good variety of supplies. They also offer heat treating if you decide to make some
stainless stuff.
www.texasknife.com/

This is also a great place for supplies.
www.kovalknives.com/
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  #3  
Old 09-04-2001, 03:58 PM
SIGGI
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Dear Bob,

Thanks for the reply. I thought that I had read it earlier but couldn't locate it. Very Good Thoughts. I'll be starting out with stock removal and hopefully moving into forging. It sure is easy to get the bug.

Now I also have to work on shop layout.

I'm sure that it will be never ending .

Bob Sigmon
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  #4  
Old 09-04-2001, 04:10 PM
Don Cowles
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Bob, a lot depends on your tool budget, but there are a few "must haves". Your first purchase should be a drill press- decent ones can be had for as little as $50 at Sears.

An assortment of 10" or 12" files is next; if you get good (Simonds, Nocholson, Grobet, etc.) ones and take care of them, they will last a long time. Handles too, though its fun to make your own.

Wet-or-dry sandpaper in grits from 220 to 1000 (more expensive than you might think).

A book or ten... some suggestions are "How to Make Knives" by Barney and Loveless; "The Wonder of Knifemaking" by Wayne Goddard; "The $50 Knife Shop" by Wayne Goddard. There are several other good ones, but this is a great starting point.

If money is no object, a 2" x 72" belt grinder is the way to go, with a variable speed motor.

If you care to let us know how much you want to spend, we can probably give you some more specific recommendations. Good luck!
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  #5  
Old 09-05-2001, 08:19 PM
SIGGI
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Well Don,

Obvoiusly, the budget is always a consideration, but it does sound like some of the best spent early money would be on a nice grinder. I do already have a drill press and assorted hand tools from working in clock repair. I also have a mini lathe and mill. I have started working with files, but my time is slightly more limited than to do all my work with files, although you do learn alot about the metal working by hand.
It also seems a metal band saw would be a real time saver when cutting out a blade from a blank.

Thanks for your suggestions.

Bob Sigmon
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  #6  
Old 09-06-2001, 05:01 AM
Don Cowles
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I may be the odd man out in terms of how I do my blade profiling, but I grind the profile rather than bandsaw it. I use the bandsaw to cut the stock to length, of course, but then I use the belt grinder with the work rest to grind up to the scribed line.
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  #7  
Old 09-06-2001, 05:55 AM
ansoknives
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Ya..so do I...it is real fast.....but ofcourse I do not have a metalbandsaw.....If I had I would use it for cutting damscus....not regullar steel.....cutting damascus with it would save some bits and pieces big enough for miniatureknives....I cut it with a hacksaw these days....

Besides this...it sounds like you allready have experience in tools...this will proove to be your best "tool" as it takes years of your learning curve!
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  #8  
Old 09-06-2001, 07:03 PM
SIGGI
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Don,

I see what you mean and it would make more sense to get the belt grinder first. Any suggestions on wheel size? I am not at all familiar with hollow grinding, so......

Thanks for your wisdom.

Bob Sigmon

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  #9  
Old 09-07-2001, 05:04 AM
Don Cowles
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I would start with an 8" smooth wheel; you can add other sizes lated if you wish.
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