Sit, Ubu, or stand? AND Dust Systems?

Do you grind sitting, or standing?

With Hibben, Draper and Chappel, I always stood up. Loveless showed me that sitting was easier, you get more control, and can make the grinder do what you want it to do easier, if you're sitting. You can also rest your elbows on your knees/legs for more stability. Or even against your sides.

You need the grinding wheel to be at the right height, so that you're in a natural sitting position, or it can get tiring, well, it does get tiring, but it's better if you're as comfortable as possible.

If my little camera will take a shot, that you can see, I'll have Bob post a pic of my cast iron dump rake seat and grinder. Sure, there's a story behind that iron seat.....

Steve-

I stand, because that's what has worked for me so far. I had a heck of a time figuring out grinder height, but I had never been to another maker's shop to see how they had their's set up at that point either.

Mine is at belly button height while standing.

I wanted to mount mine on a drill press column with the rack and pinion set-up...so I could change it's height easily, yet have a solid base... but I couldn't find one to use. It's almost as expensive to buy that much from a supplier as the whole #### machine.

If you say sit, I should try it

Nick

Nothing wrong with trying something new. Let me know how it works. Might take a bit of getting used to. I feel that it is easier on the back to sit, or stand upright, so the wheel needs to be at the hight that will allow that. Same goes for the work bench and vise, buffer, etc. Bending becomes painful in time.

I like the adjustable height idea. It is sometimes difficult to make an idea work when you have to buy parts. Maybe a used machinery dealer would have an old drill press that has a good stand?

I sit...I like the controll I get. When I made the grinder I designed it so I can vary the hight so I can stand also.

It might be variation.

There was an experiment a few years back on productivity, Are workers more productive if they have music to listen to or if it is quiet? The results were interesting. What was found was that when a quiet workplace introduced music there was increased productivity for about 4-6 weeks and then it went back to the basic status quo. When a workplace that played music went quiet, they had the same results. It wasn't the music or silence that made the difference it was the variation. Some of these factories started one month of music and one month of quiet and they found that they increased their productivity by doing so. Variation was the key.

I don't know if this applies to standing or sitting while grinding, but you may just want to try an experiment.

Thanks, Jerry.

You know, when I grind, I plug in the stereo, put on the earmuffs and go to it. It helps to have the music, especially if you can burn a disk of your favorites.

I don't know about production, but a disk full of tunes you love, and want to hear, keeps me in that iron seat longer.

Maybe standing for a while would speed me up...

What can I say, my friends insist that I am a font of useless trivia. and I am!

Ok Steve, now the suspense is killing me!!!
What is the story behind the Iron Seat????
Inquiring minds want to know.
Mike

I stand, and usually prefer standing for most everything I do (OK, don't get smart, now).

When I consider that most of my shop aprons are retired because they 1) have a hole ground into the belly area from working too close to the belt and 2) often have the frayed edges catch fire once they are very worn, I'm thinking that grinding while sitting could be a problem for me. It would also be more difficult for doing large blades like swords where I depend on my ability to sway with the motion. Grinding a big sword is like Tai Chi exercises for me.

Jerry O: All trivia is useful, to someone. Kind of like my knives....

Mike: The old cast iron dump rake seat came from my Dad's farm, before he passed away at 92. (They're quite the collecotr's item these days. ) Bob Johnson used to be known as "Plow." This was because he'd go out to the farm at sunrise, with his lunch, consisting of a baked potato, and plow , behind the horses, until dark. This would continue until the work was done, which was all spring, and all fall. When the riding implements became available, it was a lot nicer, I'm sure, than walking all the time. Anyway, that old seat reminds me of Dad and what a hard worker he was. Sometimes it shames me into "gettin' on the stick," when I'd rather goof off. If I'd work like he did, I'd be retired now!

Jerry H: I can see what you mean. Grinding a "sheleli" (sp), as my Dad would call those big knives of yours, would require much more movement and range of motion than a dropped hunter. Even a Big Bear-type is a "bit" too much of a reach for sitting, but it works for me. I straddle my dust intake, so the burned holes in my aprons are not a problem.

For me, anyway, we are now getting to the real crux of the issue. I stand, because I have a 5 gallon bucket of water directly under the contact wheel. If I had a "dust intake" there like Steve, I would be very much incliined to try sitting.

Steve, can you tell us about your dust collector? Does it exhaust outside, or into a drum of water, or what? The only time I can use a dust collector (read, "shop vac") is when I am slack-belt grinding handles; then i can put a dust intake under the grinder. Grinding steel, however, the sparks would melt the vacuum hose - or set the vac on fire.

I have the bucket to the side of the duct work on one machine. It is strapped to the stand, as it sits solidly on some cinder blocks. Then I have a little gallon bucket of water on a wheeled cart next to the other grinder. No problem in using either machine. I use 3" aluminum duct-work for the vacuum system.

Get the duct work, straights, "T's," elbows and flex sections, at one of those great home improvement stores and just duct tape it together. Tack it to the wall with those plastic ties with a sheet rock screw holding it up. Might be good to make it a downhill slope to the collector from the machines.

I have 3 inlets in the same line and just cover the unused ones with cardboard when I'm grinding into one of them. Two to the grinders and one to the buffer. I have a Torit self-contained dust collector and it works pretty well. The dust goes into a catch pan at the base of the box which holds the fan. It exhausts into the shop. Have thought of shooting it outside, but there goes the cool air in the summer and the warm air in the winter from the shop.

They have an optional, on the cheaper model, stack silencer, which drastically reduces the noise. I put the box in my assy. room and then it's not too noisy in the grinding room. The noise level isn't really that bad anyway. Perhaps with the silencer, when I can afford it, I'll move the box into that room. Might be more efficient that way, closer to the machines and all. P.S. Buy your dust collector in a town other than the one, up north, in Utah, where I got mine, since they haven't the foggiest idea what "customer service" means. That was in 1994, though. Maybe new people by now.....

I'd get the bigger model next time, if I could afford it. This one gets the light stuff, but the floor has lots of the bigger, heavier dirt on it in front of the grinder & buffer. Ricardo Velarde has a larger model with the silencer, maye he can report. Or, anyone else who has a dust system that works, or doesn't?

I've never had any concerns, or problem with fire. I haven't, yet, ground titanium, but will be doing so. And...will not use the dust collector when I do. Hope this is of help.

P.S. Bob (Dogman) said he'd post 2-3 photos re. above tonight.

Steve, this is a big help. Do you remember the model number of the Torit system you bought, and the approximate cost?

I have to do something soon. Not just to allow me to sit down to grind, but to keep the peace. My shop is right next to my wife's laundry room, and a layer of black silt in there is most unwelcome.

I sweep the floor (and pick up the dust with a long-handled magnet) several times in the course of a day of grinding, but there is a fine blanket of dust over everything, including my computers (which are in a separate room with the door closed).

I know that there is no perfect solution, but the shop vac and water bucket approach leaves much to be desired. Any help is much appreciated.

In the MSC book they list the 64 at $2091, on page 1229. Get help lifting that book around! I paid $1678 in 1994 for a model "60 CAB". They also have a 64DST for $1565. Maybe this is mine. They also have a cartridge filter version fo rmore money. I guess it was worth it, I don't have cancer yet. My grinding room is MUCH, MUCH cleaner than it was in my old shop, where all I had was a squirrel cage blowing the dust out the window. You can still see that these walls are white! They were pretty much black back then in that old room.

They list a model 84 (much more volume) at $2906. Like I said, mine could be biggger, but for another $800+? I don't know...

Check them out locally, maybe you can luck into a used one. These are made for industrial applications and aren't just the wood dust collectors that some use, with more risk of fire.

Look for my photos to be posted tonight.

Thanks very much, Steve. As much as I'd love to add another grinder to the shop, I think this is going to have to come first.