Question for the etching pros...

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

Hello Everyone,

I've been watching the etching videos and am interested in trying. What tips do you have for the following questions?

What is the safest/inexpensive acid to use?
Is glass the safest container to hold the acid?
I've seen vids where acid dip ranged from 5min to 30min. Is the range of the acid dip that varied?
I've seen vids where nail polish and wax are used for pattern making. What other materials can be used to paint more accurate patterns and designs?
Any other tips or gotchas you wish someone taught you that I should know about etching?

Thanks for reading my post!
-Scott

[DanCom]

Hi Scott,

Although I am no "pro" with etching knives I have done a fair bit of research and have etched many printed circuit boards in the past.

I see knife makers using anything from vinegar to copper sulphate to ferric chloride. I used to use ferric chloride. It is typically sold as PCB etching solution and is approximately 40%, which is quite concentrated compared to say vinegar at about 5 to 8% acid.

As acids are used to etch glass as well, probably the best container to hold the acid is the same that it ships in. This is usually HDPE. Look on the bottom of the container.

Variation in exposure time could come from a bunch of factors including:
1) the strength of the solution. This would explain why 3 minutes in ferric chloride is akin to 30 minutes in vinegar.
2) the material being etched. Copper sulphate is better suited for mild steel, whereas ferric chloride works well with stainless steel or copper.
3) how deep you want the etch to be. You could potentially dissolve all the metal if you waited long enough. :-(
4) how saturated the acid solution is. Once the acid solution becomes saturated and no longer be useful. If you're using fresh every etch this is not a problem.
5) possibly temperature. I still haven't been able to figure out if heating the solution effects etching time.

For a mask, I've used nail polish (black of course!). I've read that some makers have a special formulation of bee's wax, carefully applied with a clothes irons. Electronic supply houses will sell "resist ink" pens; like a sharpie that allow you to draw your mask on. A trip on YouTube suggests that laser printer toner resists acid. Your mileage may vary.

If you are using a proper etching acid, I'd recommend:
1) Obtain and read the MSDS for whatever etchant you are using.
2) Gloves, goggles and smock are not "optional safety wear" if you are working with 40% acid.

Or, if you don't mind waiting a bit, vinegar works fine. It's relatively safe, cheap and easy to find.

Test first. Time the process. Use the same steel as the blade you'll be working on. And clean thoroughly with alcohol so that no unwanted oil/grease/fingerprints are on the steel.

Good luck. Perhaps we can get some real world advice from the knife makers here.

Dan

[Naboyle]

Ed Caffery has a YouTube video on etching damascus. Very good information!

[Ray Rogers]

If that method is what you want to use then, by all means, go for it. But, if you are really new to all this maybe you have never heard about electro-etching. This is the method that is used by 99% of all knife makers that use an etched maker's mark. It's fast, easy, very safe. If this is news to you and you want more information about it, just ask ...

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

Hi,

Thank you all for the feedback! I looked in to the electro etching and it does look easier and requires an investment. Question, how would someone make photo realistic stencils, like an alligator, for electro etching?

Thank you again!
-Scott

[Ray Rogers]

There are companies that can do it for you from your artwork or even from your description - Marking Methods is one. They will be more expensive depending on how much work you want them to do but the stencils they make will last seemingly forever.

Ernie Grospich is another, lots of us use him to get our stencils. He's fast and low cost and his stencils hold up well. You can find either of these stencil makers through google.

As for an investment, yes, it's not free but neither does it have to be very expensive. A basic Etch-O-Matic is all you need and those cost less than $100. You may see plans for building your own and the home made units work as well as the commercially built ones but, unfortunately, it will cost most people as much to build it yourself as it will to buy one.

Finally, about that alligator. After many, many discussions on the subject of maker's marks over the last 20 years some things have become very apparent. Simply put, your mark needs to include your name and at least what state or country you are in. Without enough info in the mark for someone to locate you in a google search there is no point in bothering to mark your blades. If you can squeeze an alligator into it also then go for it but if the logo gets too complex you will have a devil of a time getting a clean burn. Also, fine, thin lines in a stencil are easier to burn out than heavier lines so elaborate artwork shortens the lifespan of the stencil. Take these things into account when designing your logo ...

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

Hi Ray,

Appreciate the feedback! Been using your search to catch up with all threads on acid/electro etching.

Since the effort to make versus buying an etcher is the same I will most likely buy.

For the stencil, similar to the DIY electro etcher, I was curious to see what investment is needed to make my own stencils for a themed knife blade. (URL for alligator knife attached below) I saw a vid on a light box that is used to creat stencils on a 8x12 plastic sheet, but there doesn't seem to be many vids on how to build one. :\ Do you know of any stencil light box tutorials? Or, as a newbie, am I going about this the wrong way?

http://www.francineetchedknives.com/...roducts_id=235

Thank you Ray!
-Scott

[racjarrett88]

I think he wants the gator for looks

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

Correct...this would be for looks.

Here's an example:
http://www.francineetchedknives.com/...roducts_id=235

Giiven the DIY electro etch information being wide spread...I was hoping to find out what is required to build a light box that allows you to create your own stencils for decorative etching.

Any feedback is appreciative.

Thank you,
-Scott

[Ray Rogers]

That would be a good subject for discussion in the Chat Room tonight. Hope you can be there...

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

I searched for chat room to find when it is and how to participae and didnt find details.

Would someone please share?

Thank you!
-Scott

[DanCom]

Try here...

http://www.knifenetwork.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=62170

Dan

[Shi_Fu_Elusive]

Sunday 5 pm to 8 pm Pacific, 8 pm to 11 pm Eastern

Perfect, thank you Dan!
-Scott

[DanCom]

I'd love to hop on and chat with y'all but it's Thanksgiving up here and the turkey requires someone with a working knowledge of propane and cooking oil. :-)

Dan

[racjarrett88]

Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family Dan.