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  #1  
Old 12-14-2008, 10:26 AM
MMOMOH-55 MMOMOH-55 is offline
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Sway bars off a car

I have several sway bars that I hate to throw out if they are any good for knive making. I am guessing that this is spring steel something like 5160? Any one use any of this in the past for forging?
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  #2  
Old 12-14-2008, 01:24 PM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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Like most salvage steel, no one really knows what it is. It will vary with the make and year and type of vehicle. Then, even with that information, the manufacturer may still not be able to tell you with certainty what steel was used. There are many economic reasons but it mostly boils down to using anything that has the right properties and is available in sufficient quantity at the time they are ready to buy materials.

So, you are left with the same possibilities that come with any piece of salvage steel. You can try the spark test, or a hardening test, or you can make a blade and test t to destruction to see what you have. Likely, you'll have a moderately decent knife but nothing great and you'll have to make and test and modify your heat treat as you go to find what works with this brand X steel. Then, it will be all used up and you'll have to start all over again with the next piece that might or might not be the same material.

If your aim is to save the world by recycling salvaged steel then more power to you, good luck, and you know what you have to do. If, on the other hand, you are simply trying to save money then I respectfully suggest that you are wasting both your time and your money as it would be much cheaper and far more efficient to simply buy some known good blade steel........


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  #3  
Old 12-14-2008, 06:59 PM
MMOMOH-55 MMOMOH-55 is offline
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Thanks for the reply. I am being cheap. I just hate to throw something away. I have probably 20 feet of this stuff and today I pounded out a 6" blade and plan to finish it to see how it will turn out. Being a sway bar and having to flex I am courious if it is some kind of spring steel.
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  #4  
Old 12-15-2008, 09:44 AM
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Ray Rogers Ray Rogers is offline
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It might be 4140 or some similar high alloy steel that is commonly used in automotive applications. You can make a knife out of any steel, even hardware store mild steel, but you won't know what you have until you test a few to destruction while you look for the best heat treatment for it. Like I said, it will likely make a fair knife just not a great knife.

Being cheap implies a desire to conserve money. That's something I can easily understand. But, when you consider the time you'll spend trying to find the best heat treat, the fuel you'll burn up, the time spent testing, not to mention the time spent making and finishing the knives, have you really saved any money over the cost of just buying some good steel? Only you can put a value on your time but I know it wouldn't work for me. Besides, I make my living this way so I can't afford to send out a blade that can't be sure will perform as I expect it to. If it's just a hobby to you and you don't sell these knives then maybe it doesn't matter so much. Even so, I would imagine that if you bother to make knives at all you'd like them to be the best you can make and salvaged steel usually won't get you there.

There's a reason why nearly every knife by any notable maker you might read about will be made from 10xx, or 52100, or O1, or D2, or 5160, etc or one of the well known stainless steels if they do stock removal. These steels produce blades of consistently high quality with all the characteristics that we value in a good blade (if you do your part). They can be properly worked with the tools most of us can buy or build. Other steels cold potentially make an even better blade but might require processes and controls that aren't easily available to us. Or, other steels have some of the characteristics we want like toughness but won't get hard enough to hold an edge as well as we might like.

One thing is for sure: whatever steel those bars are made from it isn't on the list of commonly used knife steels. None of those steels are used in modern automotive manufacture in any large parts - ball bearings maybe but not much more. So, use the sway bars and make the best knife you can but don't do it thinking you're saving any money or that the knife you get, no matter how good it may turn out, will be as good as the knife you might have made from a good blade steel .......


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  #5  
Old 12-15-2008, 08:40 PM
MMOMOH-55 MMOMOH-55 is offline
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I am fairley new to forging and need the practice. I am thinking that I can use this steel and practice before I go on to the real thing. Thanks for your comments. I have found a wealth of info and people more than willing to lend a hand with advice and info here on this site. I have made one knife and plan to make maybe 2 more before I work on the9260 I have. I have a piece of the 9260 that is 24" X 3/4" X 3/4" I got from a friend who is a machinist. I plan to make a large Tanto with this but I do not want to ruin it so I am practicing on the other first.

Thanks

Johnny
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  #6  
Old 12-16-2008, 09:29 AM
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That actually could be a very good plan. Working with salvaged steel is often much more difficult than working with a nice clean bar of steel. If you can learn to shape the salvaged steel the way you want it then the bar stock should be a piece of cake....


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  #7  
Old 12-16-2008, 01:44 PM
MMOMOH-55 MMOMOH-55 is offline
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If you saw the first knife I made you would understand how badly I need practice. It is really rough. I would like to find someone close by to maybe apprentice with close to my home. A friend of mine makes ornamental fenses and gates but his shop is all automated. Rarely does he actually hammer out anything. He has invited me to come spend time in his shop but I am wondering if I will learn anything that I can use for knife making.
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Old 12-16-2008, 02:03 PM
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Alan L Alan L is offline
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Just about anything you can learn about metalwork in general, and hot work in particular, will help with knifemaking.

I figure you might as well learn more than you need, so hopefully when you forget half of what you learned it'll be the stuff you don't use... At least that's my story. When I was 18 I knew it all. 20-something years later, I find I can barely remember which end of a toothbrush to use, so it was a good thing I learned so much, eh?

Seriously, learn everything you can. You can decide what parts of it to use later.
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  #9  
Old 12-16-2008, 03:55 PM
MMOMOH-55 MMOMOH-55 is offline
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I think that is what I am going to do. I decided at the age of 55 to start a new hobby. I have been layed off from work for about 5 months now and had nothing better to do. I have always loved knives having collected over 200 factory made knives. My favorite are the Cold Steel. I love the edge on them and for some reason I cannot seem to ruin one of them. My hunter I use for deer last the whole season. Then I ship it back to the factory for a new edge on it. I have skinned maybe 8 deer with this knife before needing sharpened. Most other factore knives last one deer and then they need the wetstone put to them.
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  #10  
Old 11-15-2012, 10:16 AM
joyee joyee is offline
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I am also looking for the knive making site but that should be trusted as well...This is why because already I have got deceive ...


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  #11  
Old 02-08-2013, 10:31 AM
Awelderiam Awelderiam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray Rogers View Post
It might be 4140 or some similar high alloy steel that is commonly used in automotive applications. You can make a knife out of any steel, even hardware store mild steel, but you won't know what you have until you test a few to destruction while you look for the best heat treatment for it. Like I said, it will likely make a fair knife just not a great knife.

Being cheap implies a desire to conserve money. That's something I can easily understand. But, when you consider the time you'll spend trying to find the best heat treat, the fuel you'll burn up, the time spent testing, not to mention the time spent making and finishing the knives, have you really saved any money over the cost of just buying some good steel? Only you can put a value on your time but I know it wouldn't work for me. Besides, I make my living this way so I can't afford to send out a blade that can't be sure will perform as I expect it to. If it's just a hobby to you and you don't sell these knives then maybe it doesn't matter so much. Even so, I would imagine that if you bother to make knives at all you'd like them to be the best you can make and salvaged steel usually won't get you there.

There's a reason why nearly every knife by any notable maker you might read about will be made from 10xx, or 52100, or O1, or D2, or 5160, etc or one of the well known stainless steels if they do stock removal. These steels produce blades of consistently high quality with all the characteristics that we value in a good blade (if you do your part). They can be properly worked with the tools most of us can buy or build. Other steels cold potentially make an even better blade but might require processes and controls that aren't easily available to us. Or, other steels have some of the characteristics we want like toughness but won't get hard enough to hold an edge as well as we might like.

One thing is for sure: whatever steel those bars are made from it isn't on the list of commonly used knife steels. None of those steels are used in modern automotive manufacture in any large parts - ball bearings maybe but not much more. So, use the sway bars and make the best knife you can but don't do it thinking you're saving any money or that the knife you get, no matter how good it may turn out, will be as good as the knife you might have made from a good blade steel .......


Very well said.
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  #12  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:03 PM
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piggy piggy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MMOMOH-55 View Post
If you saw the first knife I made you would understand how badly I need practice. It is really rough. I would like to find someone close by to maybe apprentice with close to my home. A friend of mine makes ornamental fenses and gates but his shop is all automated. Rarely does he actually hammer out anything. He has invited me to come spend time in his shop but I am wondering if I will learn anything that I can use for knife making.
I think Ray answers this same question no less then once a week. On this site I think there are about a dozen different types of steel u will hear rattled off regularly.

I was watching a video on steel being made and this one company had over a 1000 recipes on file.

If u cruse through the forum and look at some of the 1st knives posted or even when they get around to their 10th knife it is unbelievable how good some of these knives are.

You might find that part of your lack of quality just may be the steel your using. Starting w/ something almost flat and fairly smooth puts u ahead of where u are now.

Then again, as you stated, if your just playing around then have fun and enjoy yourself.
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