ats-34 and D-2 question

[t-townbob]

Hi everyone , I've just ordered some ATS -34 and D-2 from texas supply, is it possible to obtain a proper heat treatment on these steels with a simple set up? ( coal foge) or should I have went with a simpler to work steel like 1084 or 5160? What would be the outcome of using a coal forge and oil quench ?

[jes4e]

I don't think that you would be able to heat treat either of those steels in a coal forge. my understanding is that you would have to heat and hold the tempature with a verry close tolerance for a prolonged amount of time and that is very hard to do in a coal forge. now 1084, or any of the 10 seires can be done in a coal forge. don't know about 5160, but alot of forgers use it so it seems like you could. I send all of my stainless blades to peters heat treating, and have never had a problem..
Hope this helps

[Gary Mulkey]

Both of the steels that you mentioned are highly alloyed steels which require a soak time at temperature which requires the use of a H/T oven. Both are air quench steels which means that Texas Knife Supply can do the H/T on them. (Neither lend themselves to forging and should be done by stock removal.)

H/T'ing in a coal forge can be done with simple steels like 1084 & 5160 with experience but is a tricky operation as a coal forge can run as high as 3000 degrees and the wanted temperature is in the 1450 degree range. (This is approx. 50-75 degrees past non-magnetic.) If you are planning on H/T'ing on your forge I would recommend using just one type of steel until you are confident of your outcome before going on to other steels as they are all a little different.


Gary

[Doug Lester]

I agree with the ATS-34 and the D2. They are also poor choices for forging, if that is what you have in mind. My suggestion is that you see if you can return it for an exchange.

Heat treating in a solid fuel forge of any kind can be a problem. You have to make sure that your fire is even and it's probably a good idea to move the work around in the fire a bit while heating to help keep the steel heated evenly. You could also stick a black iron pipe in the forge that will contain the blade and heat it withing the pipe. The pipe will also help distribute the heat evenly. Also, if you cap off one end and put something combustible in the pipe you can creat a low oxygen atmosphere to reduce scaling.

5160 is a good steel to forge and heat treat in a solid fuel forge. With the exception of 1095, other than the 1095 sold by The New Jersey Steel Baron, the 10XX series with a carbon content above 60 points are noted to be very forgiving when it comes to forging and heat treating.

I'm also a little concerned with what seems to be a lack of research on your part. You seem to be flying by the seat of your pants here. As I read it, you are asking what would be the outcome of quenching air hardening steel, the ATS-34 and D2, in oil. The answere would quite possibly be broken blades. If you haven't alread, get yourself some reading material on the subjects and familarize yourself with them before going any farther in your efforts. You will save yourself a lot of headaches and wasted effort and money.

The $50 Knfe Shop by Wayne Goddard is good but I like The Complete Bladesmith-Forging Your Way to Perfection by Jim Hrisoulas to be a bit better, though the latter only deals with forging blades. A good reference library is probably the most important tool you can get. The boards, such as this one, are fine but they have deffinant limits.

Doug

[dbalfa]

unfortunately, when you move into the high-alloys, the tool requirements ramp up quickly (pun intended) Ye ole blacksmith pounding metal from coal forges didn't have alloid steels. Trying to HT one of those mentioned in a coal forge would be shooting at a moving target, in the dark, from a moving platform- good luck...

I would take the steel you ordered, grind or file out some knives, send them back to TKS for HT. Then, if you like the process, go further.

[Brad Johnson]

D-2 and ATS-34 make great knives but require as have been mentioned in previous notes HT of a delicate nature with exacting time/temps. Good luck!

[Robert Washburn]

Gary is right use the simple steels and remember the old saying kiss .