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The Newbies Arena Are you new to knife making? Here is all the help you will need.

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  #16  
Old 10-27-2017, 10:12 PM
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Grayshadow95 Grayshadow95 is offline
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Zoro company? Never heard of them. Do you have a web address? That just might be worth looking into.

Yes, I have a belt cleaner, it's like a giant eraser. I've used it on my woodworking disk/belt sander for years. It didn't seem to make much difference on my metal working belts.
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  #17  
Old 10-28-2017, 03:19 AM
jimmontg jimmontg is offline
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Zoro is a cheaper version of Grainger and is a subsidiary of it. Google them.


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  #18  
Old 10-28-2017, 09:13 AM
dtec1 dtec1 is offline
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Grey shadow....First you can call me by name its Dave ......I am not sure how I got the title GURU under name it just poped up one day...my perceived definition of a guru is a "expert" and a "teacher" I do not consider myself a expert by any means. I have learned a lot in a short amount of time most of it coming from the guys here and a lil trial and error (maybe more error than I would have liked LOL but I am hard headed) Even tho I really try to help the new guys that come on here especially with teaching them to HT by breaking knives and coupons to check the grain and just go through the process as it was taught to me when I was new. Even offering to test coupons for hardness and stuff like that. But again I don't think of my self as a teacher maybe more of a reflector I take the info I was taught and give that info back out.

Anyway trugrit has the best priced belts that are out there...for grinding bevels I start wit VSM ceramic 60 grit then go to 120 and 220 Norton bluefire belts...then from their I branch out usually hermes or 3m gator belts depending how far up the grits I intend to go and what I want to accomplish...I can say those belts work great on my KMG but I cannot give any personal advice on smaller grinders and how those belts would work. When I started I started with one of those cheap 4x36 grinders with the disk on the side....lets just say it did not work well at all and my hands were all ground up....I was lucky my father was still alive and offered to buy me a grinder (I don't think he though it would be over 2000$) but he kept his word so I jumped right to a KMG very early on. Other than the obvious advice that smaller belts will wear out quicker than larger belts I would sugest to try different belts and see what works best...at first I didn't want to use the 3m gators because of the cost but I got a few of them and I have found if I use all of them (80 grit to 600 grit...or if I stop sooner) they produce a good finish they do the work quick and they last a lot longer than I expected...now I use them all the time. However I did find if I jump back and forth say 80 grit 3m gator then 120 grit hermes then 220 grit Norton then back to gator....well they don't work as quick like that also they wear out quicker as you have to push harder to get back to that same finish....once I use one of them I wont switch.

I have put the plates in the freezer before I really haven't noticed any significant difference. But when I use plates I put the foil packet between the plates and blow air in on the side that the edge faces...I will stay right there and continue to blow air until I can pic it up with my hands it only takes a couple mins. I only use plates about 30% of the time if its stainless Damascus yes.....but with steels like s35vn its in the oil till in turns black then hung in a vent pipe with air blown in on the seem of the pipe. each steel is different 440c can come out good with plates and air or oil...
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  #19  
Old 10-28-2017, 11:01 AM
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Grayshadow95 Grayshadow95 is offline
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Dave,

My name is Al BTW.
The term Guru, in my opinion, is a matter of perspective. Since you have considerably more knowledge than I do on heat treating, and have been sharing that knowledge with less informed individuals, then you can be considered a Guru on the subject.

I will definitely check those different belts out. It deserves a cost to durability analysis against what I have been using.

I also have one of those 4x36 belt sanders. I use it mainly for woodworking, but also use it to profile shape my guards. I do finish work on the guards with files and a Dremel tool.

Yes, I used compressed air while holding the quench plates down for at least 5 minutes.

Jim,
Found Zoro's web site, no sale right now, will check out Amazon for other sites that may have them cheaper.
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  #20  
Old 10-28-2017, 11:44 AM
dtec1 dtec1 is offline
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Thanks Al.

Like I said I cant promis that the belts I use on a 2x72 will have the same effect as the same belts on a smaller grinder allthrough I would imagine it would translate fairly equally beside the general fact that smaller belts will wear quicker. I also think it depends how you grind I have a friend that grinds very lightly and he buys the cheapest ceramic belts that he can find and they last for him. I grind much heavier and I have tried them and they wear out quick the way I grind that is one reason why I say try a few different things and see what works for YOU

Those 4x36 are great for profiling no problems there I had a very hard time trying to do bevels with them tho. That being said I only used that machine for the very first few knives so I am sure part of it was the grinder but part of it was also my lack of experience

as far as the air yeh spraying air for 5 minutes or until cool is great I thought you had ment you only sprayed air for a short time then just let them cool under the place the rest of the way.....back to the original question on that knife I don't use d2 but comparing what you did to the spec sheet you should have a good blade but you wont know know until you test it....deffinitly keep us posted I am curious as to how it will turn out!
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  #21  
Old 10-29-2017, 11:10 PM
jimmontg jimmontg is offline
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Hello Al my name is Jim. LOL

As for your 4x36 Al, I have a link to James McClendon's YouTube channel and take a look at how he modified his grinder. He cut notches into the sides so he could do a plunge line. And see how he modified it to do a hollow grind. James is known here at TKN as jmcustomknives, I think that's it. He forges a lot of crane cable Damascus and also does file knives. James says in one of his videos that he's been using a 4x36 so long he doesn't think he could get used to a 2x72. I modified my 2x48 by screwing an 1/8th inch by 2 inch wide by 8 inch piece of stainless onto the 2 1/2 platen so I can do plunge lines. I could do a modification like James has done for hollow grinding, but I am very fond of flat grinds too.

Here's how he modified it to do a hollow grind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRqhays5vEc&t=3s

Here is his home page for YouTube. He has a nice video on testing a knife as well.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCth...Q8uuvpB2PJXSkw
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  #22  
Old 10-30-2017, 01:25 AM
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Grayshadow95 Grayshadow95 is offline
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Thanks Jim.
I'm pretty sure I've watched some of his videos.
For now, I think I'll leave my 4x36 the way it is, I use it mainly for flattening soft metals, as well as woodworking. My little 1x42 Dayton works fine for the blades since I added a 4 inch by 8 inch aluminum 1/8th inch thick plate to the tool rest. It doesn't have sides to get in the way of grinding the tang. For curved surfaces I have a 6 inch oscillating spindle sander that works great for roughing to shape, finish shaping is all done with files and a Dermel tool.
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  #23  
Old 10-30-2017, 05:21 AM
dtec1 dtec1 is offline
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I was just thinking there is a attachment that turns a 4x36 into a 2x72...its not going to be a kmg but it might be better than what you have and its a quick bolt on so you can take it off really easily and quickly if need be here is the link
http://www.akgrinders.com/
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  #24  
Old 10-31-2017, 08:10 PM
jimmontg jimmontg is offline
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Minor mistake Dave

The Jiffy conversion turns it into a 2x48 grinder.
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  #25  
Old 11-01-2017, 05:05 AM
dtec1 dtec1 is offline
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Yep your right....I remember hearing about it a while ago and only read through it quickly when I posted the link...still better than a 4x36 in my mind
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  #26  
Old 11-02-2017, 02:15 PM
WNC Goater WNC Goater is offline
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I didn't read everything on this thread but... Isn't the "file test" done after quenching and before tempering? I don't think I've heard of doing it after tempering and I'm not sure what it would tell me. But I would think if the file skates across a blade after tempering that would tell me it is too hard. I personally wouldn't want to have to sharpen that blade.


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  #27  
Old 11-02-2017, 02:24 PM
WNC Goater WNC Goater is offline
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And another good place for belts is Combat Abrasives
https://www.combatabrasives.com/store/

They have some pretty good prices on their "shredder" belts, 60 grit ceramics. You may need to buy a dozen or more but they work pretty good and hold up well. I can usually get 2-3 blades roughed in out of each one. Afterwards, I use it for cleaning up profiles after cutting out a blade, or rough shaping scales after epoxy. I use 'em up.

And +1 on Tru-Grit


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  #28  
Old 11-04-2017, 01:01 PM
dtec1 dtec1 is offline
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I have a hardness tester so I use that but I have a friend that files checks after quench and after temper as well,.....obviously if it skates that means the knife is harder than the file but he had told me on average most files will skate if the steel is abouve a 57 HRC so I would think most blades would still skate after temper
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  #29  
Old 11-04-2017, 11:36 PM
jimmontg jimmontg is offline
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D2 is a very abrasion resistant alloy tool steel, the Vanadium does that and is the reason many of the newer steels have it in the alloy. Two 2 hour tempers for D2 @400 will result in about a 61-62 hardness and for this alloy it won't be brittle to the point of being a problem like I have dropped a file and it broke, but it would be pretty file resistant, in other words a file would pretty much skate over the edge. The first air quench knife I ever made was D2 and I had it done by a professional heat treater. It made me go buy a diamond sharpener as it took a lot of effort with a medium India stone to get it sharp.

Last edited by jimmontg; 11-05-2017 at 12:29 PM. Reason: spelling
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