Randall Bore No. 7: CJ Moore sheaths

[Seussbrother]

Hey bro, you ain't trode on anything important! Keep those tidbits flyin! We're lovin this stuff!

seuss

[BoBlade]

Will do, Seussbro! Next Bore will be about pinned handles.

[grumpa]

Ron

Here is a Randall bowie that sold last weekend.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...ADME:B:EF:US:1

The Seller claimed it had a Moore sheath. I see a lot of similarities to a Moore, but I do not see zig zag stitching. Am I missing something or did Moore, like Randall, have anomalies?

Irv

[BoBlade]

Hi Grumpa,

I'm pretty darned sure that's a Moore. You can't notice the zig zag stitching from the backside and the photo of the front is too distant to tell. I know the buyer and I'll ask him about it and get back to you.

Best,

Ron

[MtMike]

I think all of us have stumbled on another piece of 'wisdom' here -- there is a lot of information being passed around on TKN forums that I visit only once in a while, and I'll bet the same is true for you guys too. Take a look in the Sheathmaking Forum, and the Sheath Gallery once in a while -- lots of good stuff there, and some current leathersmith's work guaranteed to float your boat (not including yours truly )
Meaning no disrespect to the old time leather craftsmen, there seems to be much more high quality leatherwork available today than just a few years ago. Similar to the growth in the numbers and quality of metalsmiths today, maybe it's the internet.

Mike

[BoBlade]

Good input, Mike. I for one don't venture out of my realm very often. Doesn't hurt to broaden one's horizons any. I'll be checking out the sheathmaking forum among others.

Ron

[grumpa]

Ron

Here ia another recent sale that involved a Moore sheath and a not so shabby tenite.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...ADME:B:EF:US:1

A very subtile zig zag pattern is there. The zig zag pattern allowed a wider stitch pattern where the sheath maker could make more stitches per inch, a point you have made. More stitches , without undermining the integrity of the leather, gave more strength.


Irv

[BoBlade]

Good morning, Irv

Yes: Another great knife and sheath! Thanks.

This stitching thing is getting curiouser and curiouser (translation: I'm feeling more and more like an idiot!) I took a much closer look at my three Moore sheaths (30X) and the stitching on top is NOT zig zag! The stitches are only made in the "zag" direction! The stitching on the backside bears this out (The backside stitching angles are not as defined as they are on the front for whatever reason).

Ron

[Moosehead]

Hi Ron!

I've never seen such zig-zagging in my life! I think you should switch careers and enter the realm of politics.

Mike, you're absolutely right, there are lots of interesting things to be discovered here on the Knife Network. I'll be sure to check out the Sheath Making forum. Thanks for chiming in here. Everyone is welcome even if Randalls are not your passion.

Guys, the only Moore sheath I have ever seen is a vintage Dennis Moore sheath from the mid 18th century. Unfortunately, it was stuffed with lupins so I couldn't make out the stitching...

You all remember Dennis:



Check him out here:
http://www.jumpstation.ca/recroom/co...on/dennis.html

Cheers!

Moosehead

[BoBlade]

[QUOTE I've never seen such zig-zagging in my life! I think you should switch careers and enter the realm of politics. ]

A California politician named Ronald? That would never work, Moosebreath

[SteveM]

Seems like a good time to ask about this sheath. I think it is Heiser but am not sure, it has been repaired at some time in its life.

[BoBlade]

Hi Steve,

I'm pretty sure you're right about it being a Heiser. Every now and then you get one that wasn't marked (In this case the repair could have been to replace the section that was Heiser stamped). It's sometimes hard to tell the difference in construction between a late 50's / early 60's Heiser and an early 60's Johnson. If the knife is original to the sheath, it doesn't look much later than about 1960 with that choil grind.

Best,

Ron

[smcbrearty]

And Mike is being to modest on his own sheath making ability. The one I have is one of the nicest sheaths I own.

Steve

[MtMike]

Thanks Steve -- It was inspired by a very special knife

Mike

[crutch tip]

I don't think Moore excluded rivets for any other reason than he didn't think they were necessary. I think Heiser included them because it was the order of the day for the company. I have had early non-riveted Heiser's that appear to have held up just as well as a Moore so apparently no real advantage there. I don't think Moore sheaths are necessarily superior to a Heiser for all practical puposes.
Ron is correct in his assessment that Moore had an advantage that the majority if not all of his sheaths were made to an individual knife whereas Heiser had patterns to make a standard sheath for a model and blade length. The result is Moore's sheaths sometimes appear better "finished" than a Heiser when they really are probably of equal quality.

One more thing, Moore didn't make allot of sheaths during WWII or anytime for that matter. If you examing the number of WWII era knives in Moore sheaths, the number is small relative to Southern Saddlery and Heiser numbers in that order. Most knives found in Moore sheaths were made early in the war through 1943. Southern Saddlery was done making sheaths by July of 1944. For all practical purposes, Moore was pretty much done by this time too except for a few here and there, one of a kind, or a new model. Much of the mystique of Moore sheaths is due to the scarcity.