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Old 04-01-2015, 10:13 AM
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Jacknola Jacknola is offline
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 625
Originally Posted by samg View Post
Let's consider these observations one by one.
It has been observed that Heiser and Johnson made sheaths can be descerned by certain characteristics.

1) Thickness of leather. Johnson it has been suggested, used thicker leather.
I put this theory to the test, and asked a saddle maker in Colorado about this, and his reply was that:

1) Bulls/cows from Florida come mainly from Bhrama stock, and
2) Bulls/cows from Colorado come mainly from European stock.
3) Bhrama/Florida cattle has thinner hide
4) European/ Colorado has thicker hide.

Also that leather shops purchase their hides from different places around the country.

So if Bhrama/Florida hide is thinner, how could Johnson made sheaths be consistently thicker than Heisers?
Let's start with this claim. What do you think?


Sam G
Sam in my opinion this is an example of a diversion dead end. Someone thought they might have seen some characteristic and then stated something that everyone thought sounded profound and everyone repeated it to each other until it became accepted by all.

But, before we expend the effort to chase this rabbit, let's ask:

1. Where is the documentation of this thesis?

2. Where are all the pictures, lists of sheaths examined, micrometer measurements of the leather?

3. Who did this study and how did they conclude that raw leather hides provided to different manufacturers are of different thicknesses? I would think that a leather-hide order specifying... say ... 1/4-inch thick ... would be 1/4-inch thick in both Colorado and Florida. So... how did Heiser and Johnson order their raw materials?

4. Big question - if there was a "study," did it put the H-L-K Heiser-Randall sheaths into the "Johnson-made" or "Heiser-made" category?

5. What is the proven normal range of variables, thickness, etc., within a sheath manufacturer? We know from observation that stitching fine-ness, color of thread, etc. varies widely within both manufactures. So why do we expect measurable uniformity differences in the leather used for thousands of sheaths?

Before we expend any time on this I would like to see some documentated thesis. Does whoever postulated this know anything about leather, how it is acquired, treated, sold, and then cut for sheaths? In other words, lets let someone show that their is a measurable difference in the leather.

This applies to most of the other so-called identifying attributes were posted without any thesis... They just are in the catagory of "Randall-stamp = Johnson sheath" fable in my opinion.

We have quite a number of measurable characteristic differences. No need to pursue someone's imaginative posturings unless they do the spade work. Regards, Jack

Last edited by Jacknola; 04-01-2015 at 10:19 AM.
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