Well, it had to happen sooner or later. I had some serious trouble with my shoulder earlier this year and was out of commission for almost 6 weeks. Now it's my elbow on my powerhammer arm. I've been babying it for the past month and finally just couldn't take the pain any more. I laid off for a few days and it didn't improve enough to suit me so I got tough on it.

I made myself one of those leather strap braces that goes just below the elbow joint on your forearm. Man, what a difference! In just two days, the pain is gone and my elbow isn't stiff any more. Why do those things work? I don't understand the theory behind it but can tell you that it really does work. I adjusted it just loose enough that it doesn't cut off the blood supply, but tight enough that it cuts into the skin a little. If you're having trouble with your elbow, give the leather strap a try. I used some 1 1/2" strap material for mine. It's works like magic! Hammer time!!!!

Max, I got it too but in my holding arm, yeah I like to be different :D

The DR. that gave me mine said the strap holds the tendons in place, preventing them from slapping around in your arm.

Also try a diet of boiled spinach and okra for three days, if that don't get the poisions out of your system I don't know what will. :rollin:

Seriously, though it will help to cleanse the body, when toxins get built up they settle in the joints.

Well, you're right on target Mike. I've been craving fresh garden vegetables lately. Been eating stuff like fresh corn on the cob, yellow squash, spinach greens, collard greens, mustard greens and lots and lots of fresh garlic and parsley! Now, there's a diet that will clean you out. I'll give the boiled spinach and okra a try. I'm probably one of the few that just loves boiled okra. Could eat it every day. Thanks for the tip old buddy.

Black cherries are a natural anti-inflamatory. You can buy juice in concentrated form at most health food stores. Also keep the elbow tucked in close to the ribs, and stand as close to the anvil as possible. The more the arm is extended, the more stress to the elbow.

Yeah, I'm working on that Tai. I learned about tucking my arm into my side from one of your old threads. Many thanks, long overdue. That, in large measure is what eventually lead to the healing of my bad shoulder. It's almost 100% now, but the stress was unconciously transferred to my elbow. I know I must still be doing something wrong, but it escapes me what it could be. Eventually, the problem will progress to my wrist where I have previous injuries to get all inflamed and then maybe the problem will leave my body since it will have nowhere else to go. Does that sound crazy? That's how I picture it when I'm forging. Driving the pain from my body like a physical entity. It seems to be working, but the healing process hurts like hell.

Max have you tried a chiropractor? I have an elbow thing as well as a wrist problem. Doc says Corpral tunnel or whatever the word is. But if I get a couple of good treatments from D.C. the whole thing clears up. The problem actually seems to start in the *shoulder*. Problem I have is I am a fairly big guy and not all chiropractors are able to treat me.

ghostdog

I tried the chiropractor route Ghostdog. Problem is I have to drive too far to get treated. All the local ones have a bad rep for unnecessary treatment. I've experienced it myself. I paid attention when getting treated and now chiropractor myself. Hey, it works! I believe in chiropractors as a form of holistic healing which I prefer over conventional medicine.

Thanks for the hot tip though. If it gets too bad, I may give in and get myself chiropracted some more.

There's an exercise to fix, and help prevent, blacksmith's elbow. Take a heavy duty rubber band, like is used to bundle some items of produce, and slip it over the first joints of your fingers & thumb. Flex your fingers outwards using the rubber band for resistance.

As I understand it this motion works the opposite set of muscles/tendons from hammering. It *does* work to alleviate the pain of B.E., and can help prevent it if done at the first sign B.E. is starting.

Man, I already knew about that trick! I even gave the same advice a few months ago on this forum. Sometimes, we just don't slow down long enough to see what's right in front of us do we? Thanks for the reminder Alasdayr.

I've been hunching over the anvil with elbow tucked, ever since Tai first talked about it and haven't had near the trouble I used to. That really works!

Well, the medecine (latin) name of this disease is epicondylitis. In fact it's not an infection of tendons or the joint, but an infection of the bone skin. You can get it from larger movements like forging, but that's rare. Its more the small movements you do all day long, like using the mouse or keypad of your computer. I got mine on the right arm (holding arm) from the mouse so i called it mouse elbow and the chiro told me i am right. It's hard to keep hunched over the anvil and keep the elbow tucked when you want to work with your computer mouse. :D

Achim

I wonder if there are different problems causing the same symptons? I do an exercise at the fridge that helps my elbow, wrist thing as I very rarely get to see the chiropractor (21/2 hours away). I face the fridge place my fingers on the forward edge of the fridge and turn my body away, leaving the hand on the fridge. This pulls on the shoulder but helps the elbow.
My elbow snaps and pops continuosly which seems like tendons and not a bone skin thing. gonna try the elastic exercise.

ghostdog

Sounds interesting, Ghostdog, I'll have to give that a try. I'm sure it works a lot better than what I do. You see, I do a different kind of exercise at the fridge. First I fully extend my arm, taking the handle, and with a firm grip, pull the door back towards me. Then I let loose of the handle, fully extend my arm and lift up a can or bottle. Upon opening, I repeatedly raise and lower the can to about mouth height until empty. Then I repeat the entire sequence. Sorry, couldn't resist. :)

me tooooooo:(ouch!!!!!
i lost several mos work this past winter. started in nov and didn,t really get better enought to hammer till april
i can work out and work now; just lighter
did physical therp. 4 times a week
i got an elbow band w an air bubble
raised the anvil
use a 3 lb hammer insted of 10
life is good again
.--
-
---
.theres still this plaCE in space that hurts i cant extend my arm and lift anything heavy w my palm down
this happened from useing a freakn leaf blower!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
harley
elbow possum
www.lonesomepineknives.com
.

Hello all,

I don't get into this area much but think I might stick around some.

Since you guys are forging all of the time you may already know what I am going to say and probably know more but just in case, I'll tell what I know. I appologise if it repeats something you leaned a 100 years ago but mabe someone just starting can learn something from it.

I had some trouble with blacksmiths elbow when I first started forging. A friend of mine (full time blacksmith) was over and I was forging a knife blade and he said that if I kept doing "THAT" I would get elbow problems. I asked him what "THAT" meant and he told me to stop placing my thumb on top of the hammer handle. He told me to wrap my thumb around the handle. I tend to put my thumb on top as I feel like I have more control. He told me to LEARN to control the hammer when holding it properly. For months he would say "STOP THAT" and I would put my thumb back where it belongs. I now have no more elbow problems and it has been several years now. He also made (suggested) me ajust the height of the anvil. Stand next to the anvil and stand straight up. Make a fist with you hammer hand. The top of the anvil should be just touching your knuckles at this time. Ajust the anvil height until it is correct and your low back problems will ease off or go away. This also helped me a lot.

It is GREAT having a full time blacksmith live two doors down the street. I have learned a lot from him and hope that this information that I pass on will help someone else.

hhuuuuh we,ll have to agree to disagree on this one
harley
www.lonesomepineknives.com



Stand next to the anvil and stand straight up. Make a fist with you hammer hand. The top of the anvil should be just touching your knuckles at this timemepineknivehttp

Larry,

At what height is your anvil? Knuckle high is the only thing I have ever heard. If there is a better height, let me know how it is determined.

Hey Bob, I'm with Larry on this one. I prefer my anvil to be a little higher. About halfway between my knuckles and wrist. I think that's what Larry's getting at anyway. I had back and shoulder problems until I adjusted the height of my anvil. Before that, I had it at knuckle height. I guess we all have different preferences. Do whay your blacksmith friend says unless it doesn't work for you. Hey, we all have to learn somehow.

Bob Warner, I am knew to smithing but from my web crawling looking for as much info on smithing as I can assimilate I think what your friend told you is being practised and preached by lots of smith's. It makes sense to me and is the way I have been teaching myself. Along with Max's height tip.

ghostdog

ok here goes:)
i have 2 settings 1 for my cuttlers hammer which is low but the hammer is l-o-n-g-
the other for other hammers no so long it almost waist level i hunch ove it and use sholder not arm
the thing with the knuckles at anvil hight is ok for wheel wrights but i,m a bladesmith
your friend
harley
darth possum
www.lonesomepineknives.com

OK Larry, that makes sense.

I am a bladesmith as well and I have been using mine at knuckle height for a long time now (but that is how I learned and it works for me so I never thought of changing). What I like about this height is that when I hold my hammer and place it on the anvil, the hammer face is parallel with the anvil. Therefore, I can pretty much drop the hammer and get a good flat strike on the steel. TO ME, it would cause me to hit the metal with the front or heel of the hammer face if the anvil was higher or lower. I have bad back problems and bending over for any length of time really bothers me so this height is perfect as I can stand up straight.

It is interesting how each person has their own methods to achieve the same result. A high anvil or a low anvil, a heavy hammer or a light one, etc........ Thanks for the discussion on this topic and keep it going if you have other opinions. I am interested in hearing more methods or reasons for doing what we do.

And Larry, some day I want to try my hand at pig hunting with a knife instead of a gun. Talk about an alternative method to achieve a goal! I have your web page bookmarked in my "THINGS TO DO" links page.

I like hearing the "WHY" people do things the way they do. It sparks great conversation and learning by inexperienced as well as experienced people.

I'm with some of the other guys who like their anvil just a bit higher. Wrist height seems to work the best for me on my stand-up anvil, but go about knee height for my tribal sit-down block. That extra couple inches on my stand-up anvil has lessened the amount of cricks in my back considerably.

Bob W.- Your freind is right about not putting your thumb on top of the hammer handle. It'll bring on carpal tunnel syndrome in the wrist & thumb if you do it long enough. :-(

Now, there *is* a time & place for using that particular grip. I have found it useful when working on detail/finish hammering with a very light hammer as it gives good control. Depending on the work and the particular hammer I will lay either my thumb or index finger along the handle. I am not worried about doing damage to myself as the hammer is light and I do not use this grip for extended periods of time.

it,ll make your nostrels flare:) and u will forget about your elbow and back
harley
www.lonesomepineknives.com

Good info on a reocurring theme and problem.