I've seen all sorts of knives called "tactical" in their descriptions, but I wondered exactly what was meant by the definition? It would seem that, by definition, to lean more toward a knife that might be used in a combat type of situation.

Couple of extra questions ...

1. Are their specific styles that are truly "tactical"? Why?

2. Should a knife be billed as a "tactical" knife if it has a silver (or reflective) surface on it?

3. Are pure "tactical" knives something that have long term collector value or should they be considered as simply "specialized" working knives that happen to have been hot sellers for a while?

4. Can a knife qualify as a "tactical" if it's not tested and adopted as a qualified arm by some organization that would carry it into combat situations or issue it to their forces?

My point is, I see all the knives called "tactical" out there which would not appear to be all that tactically inclined. I also see the wave of buyers who have driven up this market, but I notice that it's mainly the 20 - 30 something's that are doing all the tactical purchasing, for the most part. This leads me to believe that the market is not all that collectible, as I note that the real collector money is most likely beyond this "testosterone driven" phase of life. That is, the average man would buy one AK-47, just to satisfy their desire to own one, but they would most likely "lust" for the "Weatherby's and Seko's", once they grew past a certain age (experience) and really started looking for the more refined things in life.

The last part of my point is aimed at one thing (what I consider the collector's challenge). That is, if the long term value of something is directly proportional to a person's willingness to trade it, once owned, then should a person be concentrating on AK-47's or "Weatherby's", if he's really trying to build a collection that has lasting value?


Alex

Real collector's value in "tactical" knives seems to really lie with certain makers who make "tactical" knives as opposed to a particular style of knife. A handmade Ernest Emmerson, by the man himself, would probably bring a good price, but why? Because it can pierce kevlar, or because of who's name is on it and by whose hand it was made? I think it is a testosterone driven fad in the marketplace. True spec ops personnel do appreciate good knives, but many that I have talked to have very specialized ideas as to what constitutes a good field knife. Often they want something custom as opposed to what's out on the "tactical market." And I believe, real spec ops guys, if put to it in a combat situation would prefer an automatic firearm as opposed to a tactical knife.

To address definition, if combat proficiency = "tactical," then shouldn't the venerable Bowie be considered a tactical? And the Roman short sword? And how about kitchen cutlery? More people are killed by kitchen knives each year than tactical knives. But if it's a "look" that defines "tactical" (which I am more inclined to believe)then you have a different situation all together. Does a chisel edge, and G10 and titanium as opposed to antler and copper make it "tactical?" Kydex as opposed to leather? Image as opposed to performance? Note: I'm not saying that "tactical" knives won't perform as well as any other knives, but I think more often than not they are purchased for how they look as opposed to how they will stand up in the situations for which they were designed.

I agree with Dana wholeheartedly. It seems (sort of tongue-in-cheek) that the primary criteria are:

1) black handles
2) chisel grind
3) bead blasted (or black coated) blade.


I know Les specializes in tactical knives- I would like to see him comment.

Most of my blades are black; should I advertise them as 1/3 Tactical? :)

Why is the chisel grind used so much on what we're seeing called "tactical"?

What is the main function of that grind?

Alex

I think part of it has to do with the thick cross section (durable; can be pounded through mild steel plate)and the sharp edge (half a conventional angle). Still think I'd rather have a straight razor.

When I was interviewed by Blade Magazines a few years ago, this is what I told them a tactical knife possessed. Better than average blade steel. Example today would be, BG-42, 440V, 420V, Stellite, Talonite. On folders, the frame should be titanium, the bolster and pocket clip should be as well. The back strap should be removed and replaced with titanium spacers (this lightens the knife up as well as allows dirt, etc. to fall through. The scales should be micarta (preferably linen, although rag can be utilized for extra grip. It works best if you bead blast the material), G-10 and the handle material of preference is carbon fiber. Both for asthetics and strength. Thong hole, serrated thumb ramp and ambidextrous thumb stud. Some like to bead blast, however I prefer a 3M Scotchbrite finish on the titanium as the new owner can bring the finish back to new without aid of machinery or a knife maker. Additionally, I recommended satin finish on the blade, as a bead blast finish encourages rusting.

Blade design should be appropriate for the intended job of the knife. Again, the grinding should be applicable to the intended job. Chisel grinds are done to give strength to the tip. The trade off is that they lack circular cutting ability. Emerson did not pioneer this blade design, he only screwed it up by grinding the left side of the blade for a right handed person. He told me he did this because it "photographed" better. So much for design genius.

Fixed blades, again nature of the job and type of carry. Neck knives should feature BG-42, excellent steel, great for rust resistance. The bigger the blade the more impact and wear resistance is needed. This is why the trade off for this with rust resistance occurs. 4-6 inches you will notice a trend towards 5/32nd stock, for 6" blades 3/16th" 440V and 420V. As the blades get bigger 1/4" 7-10 inches D-2 and 3V are now the steels of choice. A-2 much like ATS-34 is last centuries technology and no longer provides the best results. Fixed blades should also be cryogenically treated for optimal results.

For smaller blades, they should always be double edged. More than likely they will double as self-defense knives. If you don't know how to use a knife properly, then don't carry one or learn how to use it. A single edge tactical fixed blade is like a revolver with only 3 bullets in it.

Larger blades should feature at least some part of the secondary edge sharpened. This will aid in removing the blade from an object should it go in so deep as to become "stuck". The sub-hilt on larger knives is useful for this as well. Additionally, the sub-hilt can be used to provide additional blade control for a larger knife. Of course a larger knife should have a thong hole. The maker should consider "indexing" points on the knife as well.

Guards should be either titanium or 416SS. Single guards are fine on smaller knives, however, in lieu of a secondary guard, there should be thumb serrations on the top part of the tang. Double guards should be on larger knives especially if they are double edged. Again, I prefer about a 400 grit satin finish on my blades. Choils are a good idea on larger knives as they allow the user to "choke" up on the blade. Remember, a big knife can do small knife chores, but a small knife cannot do big knife chores.

Carry systems have one thing in common...NO LEATHER. Someone spoke of elite units. When I was in the 101st Airborne a memo came down that you could no longer jump or rappel with a leather sheath. Of course anyone who has worked in extreme environments knows leather is worthless as a sheath material. It holds moisture (along with tanic acid), it stretches and cannot stop a blade from penetrating it.

Kydex and Concealex are now the standards for today. Smaller knives will feature kydex or Concealex with a multiposition clip attached. This allows the owner several carry options.

For larger blades, Kydex lined Cordura nylon sheaths. This will feature the SAS drop down style sheath. Multiple attachment points for military style LBE, and a thigh strap. There should also be a pocket on the front of the sheath, primarly for a smaller knife. This will afford the user an all encompassing package.

Gentlemen, tactical knives are not a fad and they are not going away. Approximately, 65% of all custom knife sales are tactial knives. As the person who sells more than his share of custom tactical knives each year. I can tell you that the demand grows every year.

Last year I designed and had made 18 tactical knives for my Vanguard series. Within 14 months all 18 appeared in different knife magazines. Ten of these knives were featured in two articles.

No other category of custom knives has a magazine devoted entirely to the category. Tactical Knives has been around for over 7 years now. If tactical knives were a fad, this magazine would be long gone.

Guys, yes the term "tactical" has become a overused catch all phrase much like "custom" which in cutlery lexicon refers now to a category. Not so much as a literal definition. Additonally, it is true that military and law enforcement people will use anything at hand. This generally stems from low pay and ignorance of what a good knife can do. Just because someone is the Military (even an elite unit) it does not mean they know anything about knives. Today's Military provides very minimal training in knife usage and none in the other units. So Military personal can no longer be used as a measuring stick for knives.

Today's tactical knife has the "look". What is the look? I have just given you some of the basics of what should be included to give the knife the "look". Knives that have the look:

Kit Carson Model 4 folder
Walter Brend Model 2 Fighter
Greg Lightfoot 460 or 458 Magnum
RJ Martin Quickening Fighter
Bob Terzuola ATCF Folder
Rob Simonich Chinook
Al Polkowski Kasper Pug, Companion or Scorpion
Jim Hammond Seal-TAC

The list is long, but those above are some of the "classic" tactical knives.

Guys I have spent years designing and using tactical knives. It's much like hunting knives. There are many different styles, however, there are really only a few that everyone agrees on that fit into the category with no debate.

You can make any knife look like a tactical knife. Will this make it a tactial knife, technically yes. In the world of custom knives, no. How do you know if it is or isn't. One way is to see how quickly you get a year behind in orders.

Please feel free to contact me should you have questions about Tactical Knives. This includes makers as well. I have a fair amount of experience in this market. I will give suggestions that will work.

Les,

Nice comments ... couple of questions still ...

What is the average age of the tipical "Tactical" buyer?

Also, you say that =/- 65% of all custom knife sales are within this category now ... what is the source of those statistics?

How are they tracking the sales?

Alex

Alex,

I don't think there is an average age of the typical tactical knife buyer. I sell tactical knives to clients ranging in age from 20-64. One thing is for sure it gets younger every year. The factories have done an excellent job of introducing both tactical and custom knife makers to their clientel.

What many former factory knife buyers tell me is that they found they were wasting their money on the factory knives. For the cost of 3 of the leading brand's knives they could get a custom knife.

This is part of the reason that tactical's are not a fad and will not fade. Today's introductory knife to the American teenager (and younger) is no longer the Case Trapper, the Hen and Rooster 3 blade Stockman. It is now the CRKT Hammond Mirage or Halligan KISS. The Benchmade AFCK or Elishewitz Models, Outdoor Edge Carson M-16, Spyderco Terzuola or Centofante models.

Factory knives have run into trouble on two fronts. First, the main collectors of the "collectible" versions of this knives now have an average age of close to 60. Many of these collectors have been at it for 50 years. Most have all the collectable knives they need. So that aspect of the market is slowing. Want proof, check out the NKCA. Memebership is down, show attendance is down and they just sold their museum to pay off their debt. When I joined that organization in the 80's, it was the most powerful knife organization in the world.

Second, the younger collectors of today are not interested in the vintage factory knives. They are not interested in their "grandfathers" knives. Some no name steel, nickel silver and jigged bone have been replaced by ATS-34/154CM, titanium and carbon fiber.

The factories have made affordable what 15 years ago was not.

Additionally, there is the "wow" factor among collectors and their "peer group". Certain names will inspire the "wow" factor. This alone is enough reason for the person to buy the knife. This is where advertising and articles come into play. There is a lot of background noise in the custom knife market today. If you as a maker do not do something to step out of it you will disappear and/or never get the recognition (or prices) you want to get for your knives.

Alex, I base the 65% on my informal gathering of statistics. I base it on my sales, and the sales of other dealers I know. Makers, both who sell tactical knives and used to sell other type knives.

Contrary to popular belief, I sell other types of knives. I sold 6 Damascus folders at the East Coast Custom Knife Show. I even sold a couple of Michael Walker knives for a friend.
Additionally, I sell a lot of hunting knives.

This is also an interesting trend. Now that fixed blades are having their turn in the bucket again. People are either entering or transitioning to the fixed market. They are doing the same thing that folder buyers did, buying a relatively inexpensive fixed blade and going from there.

Hunting knives are the most plentiful as they are the easiest to make and cheapest to build. Want proof go to the Blade Show. There are several thousand hunting knives at that show. The Blade Show has always been a new knife maker showcase in regards to the major shows.

So expect to see a increase in hunting knives sales. A year from now you will start to see an increase in large bladed tactical fixed blades sales as well. Damascus folders are selling well but only from a group of about 25 makers. Multi-blade folders have found a certain niche. However, it is mainly Tony Bose drivinging this train. Tactial D/A auto's will continue to grow.

Guys, tactial knives are not a fad. They are in fact the life's blood of the custom knife market right now. They have been for the last 7 years. I will go so far as to say if it were not for tactical folders the custom knife market as we know it would be very small right now.

Many buyers after the "interframe" crash left and did not return. It was the guys buying those $300 tactical folders that jump started the custom knife markets heart again.

Even if you can't stand tactical knives and never want to make one. Understand that most of the advertising dollars that keep the knife magazines in business comes from tactical knife makers and dealers who sell a lot of tactical knives.

This money provides the magazines the ability to do articles on the type of knife you make or want to make. Regardless if you make neo-primitive, hunters, art or swords. Take advantage of the interest in knives the tactical market is creating and try and make enroads into that market.

I have always found, from a business point of view, that a lot of knife makers let "ego" stand in the way of increasing their position in their chosen market. If Corporate America were involved in this they would find which sector had the largest market. Then adopt two course of action:

1) Enter that market with their own product

2) Look for the weakness' of that market and then exploit and capitalize on that weakness. This is what the tactical folder makers did 7 years ago.

In today's market versatility is the key. If your not willing to do it then someone else will.

In the book Im writing I have 7 questions a collector/buyer should ask a maker. You will start hearing these questions in different forms, but all looking for the same answers. Those makers who answer with negative responses will start to lose sales.

When I first told Steve Shakelford about this. I told him I had a notebook with over 350 names in it. Alll had lines through the name. Back when I could walk through a show and ask these questions I did. He told me he would like to see the names in the notebook. I laughed and asked why? None of these makers are around any more.

Make what you want, be innovative, versatile and make what the collectors want or will want. Make the path, don't wait for another maker to do it for you.

What are the 7 questions, Les?

Hi Dana,

Those will be found in my book. Look for it on sale at this years Blade Show.

The questions are geared to enable collectors/investors to make judgements about a makers long term marketability. Do these makers have a good chance of being desireable 10 years from now? Are they worth spending your money with?

My experience has been that if the maker gives me more than two negative responses that his career will be short lived. This was true 12 years ago and it is even more true today.

Versatility, customer satisfaction and professionalism are now mandatory for those who want to make custom knives as a full time profession. If your not willing to give the customer what they want, another maker will.

I used to get so tired of hearing that "Im an artist" I could puke. It's not that these guys weren't artists. But they used this as an excuse for poor execution, missing delivery times, charging more for a knife than the agreed on price, and other like items.

These "artists" are quickly loosing there position in the market. Want proof compare the makers who were desired 10 years ago to those who are desired now. Check a Knives 1991 and compare to now. Lot of different makers.

I realize there are those collectors who do not care if their knife will hold it's value. They only buy because the knife appeals to them. That is fine. However, for the other 98% of buyers who will sell or trade a knife or two in their collections. A knives ability to maintain at least most of it's value is at least some what important. My questions for makers and homework questions for collectors are geared to make the buyer think before they hand the cash over.

Bad Business Ethics ... anyone should fail if they lack those. Who cares what you blame it on. That should be a red flag immediately.

In fact, since we're on the subject. Here's a rule that has taken me a long way. This is going to be in my book, but since it probably won't sell, I'll tell you all for free this time. Besides, it'll be 20 years before I get any time to start writing it, looks like. ;)

"If a man tells you something that he's going to do, and he doesn't do it exactly like he says, without consulting with you ... mark it down. If it happens twice, mark him off your list. If he gives you an excuse, listen, weigh it, then mark it down. If he gives you another in succession, write him off! He's not worth your time, unless you have time to waste."

Life is too short and your time is too valuable to play around with amateurs. Look for people that do what they promise like clockwork and chances are, you'll never get burned.

Be one of those people ... and you can write your own ticket in life!

Remember ... "the world will pay you exactly what you ask of it .... and nothing more!"

Alex

Maybe I'm a bit naive, but am I to understand that there are makers who actually charge more than the agreed upon price for their knives? When first starting out, I "ate" a few knives, because I underestimated what it would take to make them. But that was my mistake, not the customer's. I have always honored my price, even if I ended up losing on the deal. And I've not (even in those situations) turned over anything but the best work I was capable of. My name and reputation are all I have in this business. Thankfully I have never had a knife returned to me, and I'd like to think it is because I do take pride in my work and try to give more than 100%.

There are times when something happened mid-production that left me less than satisfied with the finished product. They were little things, that the customer would probably never have noticed, but I knew those little things were there. I relegated such pieces to my "basement collection," busted my tail, and made another to my standards, and even if I had to miss meals or work all night long to make delivery time. It is because I am an artist, that I insist on only my best work going to the customer.

Being an artist (to me) means a balance between creativity and just plain old doing it right. And, the doing it right extends beyond my efforts in the shop. It means honoring my word and doing the customer right on all fronts. There's an art to knifesmithing, and there's an art to servicing the customer as well.

Hi Dana,

Yes, there have been cases of makers I know who have quoted one price then upon completion of the knife charged another. This was usually after the customer had paid a "healthy" deposit. Which of course is non-refundable.

So the maker holds the customer, the knife and the money hostage. Most customers pay the extra money then get the knife. Of course from then on every time they look at the knife it irritates them. To the point that most sell the knife and many leave custom knives for other hobbies.

In one case the maker told the customer, that he was an "artist" and sometimes the artistic flow takes him beyond their original concept. Consequently, as an artist he must follow the new artistic flow. Even if it costs more money, and he didn't check with the customer, etc. This is what I mean by "artistic crap".

I tell the customer, that is when you pay with a credit card. Receive the knife, call the credit card company put a stop payment on the money. Then send the knife back to the maker. Tell him it just doesn't "Sing" to you.

Also, since it was not what you originally ordered and extra work was done without your permission. Legally you can do two things:

Decline the knife or keep the knife and only pay what was requested. Just like if someone sends you a TV that you did not request. Then calls up and says we knew it was such a great deal you would love it. Legally, you do not have to pay for the TV or send it back.

As you say Dana there is an "art" to most things. Creating the "art" is just one aspect of being a custom knife professional.

Hey, I thought this was supposed to be about Tactical Knives....

Your right, Les, but what's been said in addition to what constitutes a tactical knife I feel has been worthwhile.

What Les said about "being pissed everytime you look at the knife, once you accept something you should left alone", is sooooo true!

Alex

Thankfully, I've never had that problem with a custom knife. All I have purchased ended up being great purchases and netted me good and friendly relations with the makers. However, once I purchased a forged Gendai Katana from a "restorer/polisher" who was to take it out of its military mounts and dress it for my Iaido blade. I paid a reasonable (for the object) but high down payment. It took much longer than promised. Call after call was made and excuse after excuse was given. Finally I was told it was near completion and upon receipt of the balance owed the Katana would be shipped. Because I really wanted the sword, I sent the balance. A year later, I still didn't have the sword. It was not until I hired an attorney and went after the guy that I received my money back. First time around the check (to me) bounced. So I had to have my attorney go after him again. 2nd time my bank verified the funds 3 times and on the 3rd time checking, he had the funds, so I cashed the check. I still get angry when I see Japanese swords for sale.