This post is the first one where we'll actually build the barlow linerlock together.

So post your questions, comments, photos of WIP, etc. rat here.

Without further ado, Im going to post my WIP to date.:flame:

I've cut out the outline of two blades from the barlow design, pasted them onto a piece of 3/32" 154CM and rough sawed the outline. I always make two blades at the same time.

I've drilled and reamed thru the paper patterns for the 3/16" pivot holes in the blades.

I've drilled a mounting hole past the tip of each blade so I can mount the b;ades onto a tooling plate.

Next I've set up my tilting table on my milling machine in order to mill the blade flats.

Lastly, I have milled the flats on both sides of the two blades.

I cut the extra stock off the blade ends, ground in the cutting edge profile, and polished the cutting edge up to the tip.

Then I blackened the tip cutting area with a black marker and I've set up my height gage on the surface plate and am scribing the center line of the blades so that I can see how much to grind each side of the tip and have the cutting edge centered.

Actually I scribed two lines .025" apart. I grind the tip on each side to the layout mark.

The blade flats are finish ground to 220 grit , ready to cut apart.

Now I've got two blades. It's time to grind the back spacer stop and then the lock notch.

The disk sander table is set at 90 degrees to the disk surface. I'm finish grinding the back stop surface square.

I've set the disk sander table at 8 degrees from 90 and am grinding in the lock notch.

The last view shows how I've machined a sharp angle on the back of my disk. This makes it easy to get a square corner in the notch. There are other reasons for this. It comes in handy while making slipjoints.

HOLLY MOLLY , I havent even got my plans and material yet.

Dwayne, Paypal has always sent me a notification when someone sends money. This time for some reason they haven't sent me the email, so I didn't know you and Brett had paid for the plans.

I just checked my account and found payments from you and Holmsy.

We'll get the plans out tomorrow, priority mail to you and airmail to Brett, since he's an Aussy.

We did send the plans to Cap Hayes.

I'm really sorry about the delay.:o I had been wondering if anyone else was going to participate. Now I know it was my fault for not checking my account.:(

Anyway, this thread will be here a long time to come. Start when you have everything.:doubleenf

So here's what I have now. Two blades ready to fit the liners.:D

I've cut out the paper pattern fom the design and traced around it with a black marker on two pieces of steel and am sawing the spacers out.

I ground the end of the spacer that forms the blade stop and it's ready to mount on my tooling plate with the blade, bushing, and both liners in one stack.

The plate already had a 1/8" reamed hole so I put in a pivot pin, then the two liners, bushing and blade.

Now I'm ready to drill and ream all the dowel holes.

gee don you been busy, of course we cant catch up with you if you dont send us plans, dont give me excuses about paypal i know your holding out so you can be first to finish, ha ha ha.

would you beleive this has been keeping me awake at night and i havn't even started yet. im like a kid counting down to christmas.
i still need to order all my materials though. gonna have to scrounge some cash though. unfortunately im in heavy saving mode at the moment because i gotta drive across the country at the end of the month and when i did it the first time it took about $400 in petrol. and my weekly wage is only 100.

Don, being mostly a fixed blade man i have never really bothered with reaming so how exactly do i do it? when you say a 1/8" reamed hole, do i drill with a 1/8" bit then ream or do i drill undersized and ream? and how much undersized?

any chance of a drill bit and reamer shopping list don?

Brett

Use a standard HSS straight flute reamer. You need a 1/8 " for the pivot and a .126 diameter for two dowels. Or you can use more 1/8" pivot pins instead of dowels. Dowels are always oversize a little to get a press fit, which we don't want.

Drill reamed holes using a drill .005" to .010" smaller than the reamer. There are optional 1/16" dowel holes in the plans. If you use the 1/8 dowel pins, just drill the 1/16" holes.

Always use drilling fluid or tapping fluid on reamers. Otherwise they'll cut oversize.

If you guys are metric, then select the closest metric drills and reamers.

You should have the design within 4 days from tomorrow, so probably the first of next week.

I forgot you have 5/32 pivot pins, so get a reamer to fit.

Again, sorry about the delay. I don't understand why Paypal didn't notify me. ???:eek:

Hey Don.
Someone is going to have a Robinson type Barlow for Xmas !!! You will have it complet4ed in no time. Frank

don,
these are the reamers i was looking at
http://www.texasknife.com/store/images/REM1.jpg
theyre from texas knife supply, are they the right kind?
i use all imperial drills and things because all my supplies come from the u.s. it sure would be good if you guys would learn the error of your ways and just convert to a system that makes sence.

for a 1/8" hole i would use a .120 drill and then ream?

brett

Don , don't forget to check your snailmail , also ! I sent a check by mail. Joe

Frank, you're right. A customer ordered a barlow for his son as a Christmas gift, so one of these is sold.

don,
these are the reamers i was looking at
http://www.texasknife.com/store/images/REM1.jpg
theyre from texas knife supply, are they the right kind?
i use all imperial drills and things because all my supplies come from the u.s. it sure would be good if you guys would learn the error of your ways and just convert to a system that makes sence.

for a 1/8" hole i would use a .120 drill and then ream?

brett

Yep. straight hss reamers. drill around .005" smaller than the reamer. You might want to check the prices at Enco.

Don , don't forget to check your snailmail , also ! I sent a check by mail. Joe

Hi, Joe.

I haven't received the mail, but I'll send the design as soon as you give me your mailing address. Email me. donwrobinson@earthlink.net

Don , don't forget to check your snailmail , also ! I sent a check by mail. Joe

Got it this afternoon, Joe. Will send the design tomorrow.

First thing I did here was to carefully line up all the pieces and clamp everything down to the mill table/riser block/tilting table. This step determines the blade to handle alignment when the blade is open. Make sure the tip of the blade is tilted downward from the handle liners a little.

Make sure you have plenty of extra stock on the back spacer inside and outside.:gossip:

I'm drilling with a .120 drill and reaming with a .126" reamer because I intend to use dowels, which are a little oversize.

I'll drill and ream 2 holes thru the back spacer and both liners.

Thanks , Don ! I'm ready to start as soon as I get the paperwork. Joe

Put the knife together with one liner and determine where stock has to be removed in order for the blade to close properly.

I need to profile the kick and the area of the back spacer it contacts, then I need to remove a little from the back spacer because the blade hits it after finishing the kick area. See where my screwdriver is pointing?

Put the knife together and grind the profile all around so that everything matches and it looks like a barlow after fitting the kick and backspacer.

The second photo shows the blade fitted to the back spacer.

The last picture here show the knife all profiled and the knife blade opens and closes correctly.

Next chore is to cut the lock into the right hand liner.

Looking good, if I do say so myself!;)

Brett, Canada made the mistake of making that conversion many years ago. I say mistake since I still haven't learned to use it. Frank

I've placed the right side liner. backspacer, pins, and the blade with it's bushing on the tooling plate again using the same holes as before.

I layed out the lock by scribing a line along the lock notch in the blade, then laid out the long cut so that it intersects the lock notch line just below the corner of the notch and then made the line about 1 1/2" long, slanted the line until it's about 3/16" from the edge of the liner.

Wow, that's a convoluted statement, isn't it?:gossip:

I drilled a 3/32 hole thru the liner at the intersection and at the other end of the lock bar to give the cutoff wheel a place to end cleanly.

Make sure the intersection hole is mostly to the front of the lock bar.

I cut the long cut first using a Dremel #409 cutoff disk on an arbor mounted in my mill chuck,
lined up the short cut and did the same.

Make sure to cut past the front of the lock, just leaving the shine from the layout scribed line.

Clamp the plate with the right side liner, backspacer and pins back onto your mill or drill.

Place the blade and its bushing in place over the pivot pin and hold it against the stop area on the backspacer.

Move your setup or table until a #53 (.0595) drill is within about 1/16" away from the upper left corner of the lock bar.

Raise the spindle and see if the drill tracks all the way around the blade shank. It should be on solid metal all the way around until the blade is closed against the kick.

If it looks OK, center drill the location and drill (#53) thru the liner.

Now close the blade up hard against the kick and center drill again. Then drill thru the blade with a #55 ( .052 ) drill.

You have just made a press fit for the ball in the lock bar and placed an undersize hole in the blade for the detent that holds the bade closed in the handle. :101 :101 ;) :D

Remember not to move anything except the spindle until both holes are drilled!!!

Drill all the tapped holes thru the stack of liners and backstop, and drill and tap the holes for the bolsters and scales.

The tapped holes for the flat head screws that hold the liners together are all in the right side liner.

NOTE!! Drill all the holes at once thru the stack, then open up the holes in the left liner and backspacer for clearance on the screws.

Tap all the holes for screws, including the holes in each liner for the screws that hold the bolsters and scales in place.

Countersink the holes in the left liner for the two flat hd. screws that hold the liners and backspacer together.

Pretend you don't see one of the countersunk holes for the flat hd. screws. I did something??? wrong and got one set out of alignment.

Not to worry, no one but you and me will know they are there.;) :D

Since the pivot hole in this knife is lower toward the bottom side than the top, I'm going to hide the pivot screws under the bolsters and have laid out all the other holes in a straight line on the center of the handle.

Hiding the pivot requires two screws on the outside of each bolster.:gossip:

Hey Don, I just got the plans tonight when I came home from work. I'm hoping to get a little work done on this over the weekend. I'll see if Alan wants to make one alongside me. If he does, I'll try to get him involved in the thread.

Hey Don, I just got the plans tonight when I came home from work. I'm hoping to get a little work done on this over the weekend. I'll see if Alan wants to make one alongside me. If he does, I'll try to get him involved in the thread.

Good. Who's Alan? The more the merrier!

Alan Folts, he's around here, but he doesn't post much. Alan has sort of become my local (75 miles away) mentor and I spend as many Saturdays or Sundays as I can with him in the shop. He's a very talented maker and we're supposed to be doing some folder work, so I think this is a good opportunity :doubleenf

Alan Folts, he's around here, but he doesn't post much. Alan has sort of become my local (75 miles away) mentor and I spend as many Saturdays or Sundays as I can with him in the shop. He's a very talented maker and we're supposed to be doing some folder work, so I think this is a good opportunity :doubleenf

That's great! I owe Alan Folts a favor. I hope he participates with you. :):)

I heat treated my blade and backspacer over the weekend, but didn't have time to work on the knife today. The blade and spacer are made of 154CM.

It won't take long to finish now!:)

the rest of you are being quiet. hope you're all working on your barlows.

Has anyone NOT received the design yet??

Alan Folts, he's around here, but he doesn't post much. Alan has sort of become my local (75 miles away) mentor and I spend as many Saturdays or Sundays as I can with him in the shop. He's a very talented maker and we're supposed to be doing some folder work, so I think this is a good opportunity :doubleenf

Please tell Alan I haven't had time to use the material he sent me, but when I do I'll get in touch with him.

Thanks.

been quiet because ive got nothing to say don. i havn't received the plans yet but thats to be expected with international post. I havn't even ordered supplies yet, im finishing up the knife thats going to pay for the supplies, it should be up for sale in the next few days and hopefully it sells quick so i can get my order in soon.
brett

I received plans today . Will try to start tomorrow. Joe

Hey Don, I'll let Alan know this weekend. Spent last Saturday finishing up a KITH project and watching Alan grind out several blades. I think he's in on this one, we might just be slow starters. I also have to make a kitchen knife for the wife and I think he'll be finishing his projects over the weekend, so after those we'll get to folder work. Days in the shop never seem to go as fast as I expect them!

I got my plans , and got all of my supplies in , thanks Don. I'll be a slow starter as I have nine knives to finish before Christmas. When I get those done I'll start on this project , I hope you can wait that long.

Dwane

It's good to hear you've got everything, Dwayne. :101

But I can't hold my breath that long.:help:

Here is photos of Barlow -in-progress. Handles are stabilized maple burl, carbon fiber bolsters , 0.050 titanium liners & 416 ss backspacer. Blade is in process of heat -treat. May do some filework on spacer while waiting on blade.

Happy Thanksgiving,

Joe

<img src="http://www.fototime.com/946780D51840B3A/standard.jpg" border=0 alt="Hosting provided by FotoTime">

<img src="http://www.fototime.com/9598948F894DDB3/standard.jpg" border=0 alt="Hosting provided by FotoTime">

That looks great, Joe.

Be sure to heat treat the back spacer since it's the blade stop.

Very nice Joe , are you going to anodize the Ti liners ? Your fast too :rockon:

Hey Don , I was wondering if I could change it up a bit. I'd like to scale it down a little , its a bit big for my liking.

Dwane

Thanks for the headsup on heattreating the backspace , Don . Dwane , I don't have the capability at this pt. to anodize the liners. Hopefully , I will be able to do tnat before too long.

Joe

Very nice Joe , are you going to anodize the Ti liners ? Your fast too :rockon:

Hey Don , I was wondering if I could change it up a bit. I'd like to scale it down a little , its a bit big for my liking.

Dwane

Sure, just use your printer or copy machine to change the size to something less than 100%. Don't stretch or distort it, just tell the machine to make it 80% of the original or whatever you want, and all the part relationships will be maintained.

Be careful though, you need room for the lock notch, detent ball and everything to work correctly. Personally, I wouldn't attempt to make a linerlock any smaller than the design. In the pivot/lock area, anyway.

By the way Dwane, my congratulations on winning the Old Ironsides project.:101

And I agree, Joe is fast AND good!:D

gee joe thats a great WIP. even in the really dark picture the maple is stunning. interesting combo of carbon fibre and maple, i look forward to seeing that one finished.
im really getting antsy to start now, i just wish i had all the bits.
brett

Thanks for the headsup on heattreating the backspace , Don . Dwane , I don't have the capability at this pt. to anodize the liners. Hopefully , I will be able to do tnat before too long.

Joe

Sure ya do! Take a 15 volt cordless drlil battery, grab some tsp or one of the many toher useful things people use to anodize, like windes, hook the wires up, get it in the solution. The 15V should give a nice purple colour. If you don't have that, use 9v batteries, put them in series to get a higher voltage and go to town! You can also use pepsie to anodise with.

Trenton

I couldn't handle it , since I had all of the materials , I had to at least cut them out. I cut out two , I try and always make at least two at the same time. I flat ground the blades and cut them apart , put the pic on the liners and back spacer. Marked all of the holes , except the ones for the scales. I'll mark them after its all ready and working properly.
Question 1: the .125 "dowell" holes , what kind of dowell ? Can I use a .125 SS pinstock.
Question 2 : what is the 1/16" dowell for , twards the fron of the back spacer ?

Dwane

Thanks, Trenton ! I'll have to try that but it sounds too easy !

joe

I couldn't handle it , since I had all of the materials , I had to at least cut them out. I cut out two , I try and always make at least two at the same time. I flat ground the blades and cut them apart , put the pic on the liners and back spacer. Marked all of the holes , except the ones for the scales. I'll mark them after its all ready and working properly.
Question 1: the .125 "dowell" holes , what kind of dowell ? Can I use a .125 SS pinstock.
Question 2 : what is the 1/16" dowell for , twards the fron of the back spacer ?

Dwane

Caution, Dwane.:gossip:

Don't drill any holes except the pivot holes until the parts are cut out and assembly has started. The location of the holes in the design may vary on your knife because the parts won't match the design perfectly. Place all the holes where there is room. Don't use the design locations.

Take it step by step as I showed. The 1/16" dowel in the front of the backspacer is used to stabilize the assembly and is optional. Probably won't be necessary.

A dowel is an industrial pin used to press fit 2 or more parts together in order to maintain alignment. Dowels are very slightly oversize so that they need to be driven into the holes. For the knife we don't want press fits, since the knife will be assembled and taken apart many times before it's finally finished. You can use pivot pins for dowels in the knife, but they cost about 100 times more than a dowel. Use a reamer .001" oversize or simply ream out the hole after it's drilled with a drill that's .001" oversize.

Your pin stock will work as a dowel if it isn't too much undersize. The purpose of dowels is to hold all the parts in proper alignment. Screws only clamp the parts together and can't be used for alignment.

I hold my bolsters together with pivot pins and screws so I can grind the back sides together so they match, then seperate the bolsters and dovetail them.

Next I mount the bolsters on the liners and dovetail the scales to match the bolsters.

Then I mount the scales on the liners and rough saw the scales to the liner profile.

I didn't like the antler scales so I threw them away and made another set from red jigged bone.

The second picture here shows the green anodized liners with blue edges.

I've cut the nail nick using a Dremel cutoff disk on the milling machine the same way I cut the lock with the exception of using a thicker heavy duty cutoff disk.

I've ground and hand sanded the blade to 2000 grit and etched my name.

This little knife is ready to put together and polish for the last time.

Here are pictures of the finished knife. It's ready to go to its owner, but not until after the TKA show week after next.:gossip:

Now I've skipped over a lot of the steps. It's hard to pick this up after a holiday interruption.

I can explain how I did anything if you aren't clear and want to ask.

I used a STEEL CUTTING checkering file from Brownell's to make the serrations on the lock leaf. 25lpi.

I've just recently finished a larger linerlock and I used the same file to checker the S30V back spacer before I heat treated it.

So now if you need help, just ask away. :help: :101

Hi Don,
I got my copy of the plans in the mail yesterday. Thanks very much. Don't know about this quick pace, but I'll give it a go. Good luck to everyone.
Take care, Craig

That's good, Craig.

Keep us informed of your WIP.

Come on, you guys, lets see some more posts. We started this to create more interest.

No more questions?

Has anyone learned anything???;)

don,

how would i get those blueprints you have of this?

ed

don,

how would i get those blueprints you have of this?

ed

Hi, Ed.

Go here and scroll down to post # 355.http://www.knifenetwork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27870&page=24

so what paypal address do i send it to?

ed

donwrobinson@earthlink.net

I hope you join us, Ed.:D

Gotcha, Ed.

Your design will be sent Monday.

Ed, have you started your barlow?

i just got the plans in the mail today. havn't gone over them enough yet. biggest problem I am going to have is the blade itself. cutting and heat treating.

Ed

ok question,

0.050 Ti sheets. What do I need to work with that? I have been hearing some very nasty things about Ti.

Ed

ok question,

0.050 Ti sheets. What do I need to work with that? I have been hearing some very nasty things about Ti.

Ed

If you have no steel cutting band saw, a hack saw or a cutoff wheel in an air grinder or dremel can be used.

i do not have a metal bandsaw, yet. I do have a dremel and some hacksaw blades. I found out recently the fiberglass cutoff wheel works super well on steel. I also have a 6" grinder I use mostly for buffing.

Ed

Hey Ed, just watch the sparks off the Ti. It will set things on fire pretty quick if you get it hot and you just have to wait for it to stop burning.

Looks like a job for a class D type 1 extinguisher.

Think for this one I will use stainless or brass instead of Ti untill I can get some additional things to handle the metal.

I am also going to contact a guy I know who makes some AWSOME damascus and do the blade in that.

Ed

Looks like a job for a class D type 1 extinguisher.

Think for this one I will use stainless or brass instead of Ti untill I can get some additional things to handle the metal.

I am also going to contact a guy I know who makes some AWSOME damascus and do the blade in that.

Ed

Ed, brass won't work for a linerlock. stainless won't either unless you know how to heat treat it to spring hardness after the liners are finished. Use Ti. It makes a natural spring.

The blade has been heat & cryo treated & the Barlow finished. I apologize for my poor photography. Happy New Year , Joe
http://www.fototime.com/39875360BAD5094/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/C71366DE7740A5A/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/53C312D458215ED/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/65DD3C4E1662B67/standard.jpg

Very nice work, Joe.:D

I notice that you chose to use a blade stop pin instead of using the back spacer as the stop.

Is this your first linerlock?

What is the handle made of? Ironwood?

Don't forget to show us the next one.:gossip:

Thanks , Don ! This was not my 1st linerlock , I make my 1st in May. I went to the stop pin after I accidently ground the back of my blade too short & decided that was easier than making a new backspacer. The handle is stabilized maple burl .

you know what joe, that was just the kick in the pants i needed. im gonna place my order for materials first thing on monday, i have been sitting back for way to long on this and i have christmas money just waiting to be spent. I sure hope mine comes out as nice as yours.
brett

Brett, do you have the design?

Join us.:D

Brett, do you have the design?

Join us.:D

gee don im starting to worry about you, i think your memory is failing:banplease , if you look in the thread where you anounced the challenge was open again i was the first to sign up. It has just taken me a while to get around to doing something.

anyway,
i have just spent about 2 hours studying the plans and all of your WIP posts don and i think i have it all sorted in my mind but i do have some questions.

1. ON your plans it shows the lock side liner as haveing 2-56 tap thru 3 places, which apears to be the holes used for holding the scales on but then on the other liner it shows them as 1-72. is this just a typo or is there something i'm missing. and if its a typo which do ou recomend?

2. on the lock side liner it says "1/16 drill, tap 1-72 2 places" this is the screws that go through the spine and hold it together do i use a 1/16 drill bit or should i use the size which is recomended for a 1-72 which sheffield say is #52

3. is it posible to use a .125 reamer with dowels or is it too tight a fit, due to international postage i wnt to order from one place only and none of the knife places have .126


this will do for now because the huge amount of stuff to buy for this first one are sending me crazy, i cant wait for the second folder, i will have the stuff by then.
brett

also,
sheffield have bronze bushings OD 3/16 ID .1265 will that be too loose on the pivot pin?

Brett

gee don im starting to worry about you, i think your memory is failing:banplease , if you look in the thread where you anounced the challenge was open again i was the first to sign up. It has just taken me a while to get around to doing something.

anyway,
i have just spent about 2 hours studying the plans and all of your WIP posts don and i think i have it all sorted in my mind but i do have some questions.

1. ON your plans it shows the lock side liner as haveing 2-56 tap thru 3 places, which apears to be the holes used for holding the scales on but then on the other liner it shows them as 1-72. is this just a typo or is there something i'm missing. and if its a typo which do ou recomend?

2. on the lock side liner it says "1/16 drill, tap 1-72 2 places" this is the screws that go through the spine and hold it together do i use a 1/16 drill bit or should i use the size which is recomended for a 1-72 which sheffield say is #52

3. is it posible to use a .125 reamer with dowels or is it too tight a fit, due to international postage i wnt to order from one place only and none of the knife places have .126


this will do for now because the huge amount of stuff to buy for this first one are sending me crazy, i cant wait for the second folder, i will have the stuff by then.
brett

Brett, I'm 72 years old and yes, I'm losing my memory.:( But anyone in this challenge who has been asleep for months may be forgotten by me.:D

What revision is shown in the title block on your design? The latest revision is 6/16/05. The tapped holes should be 1-72, but 2-56 will work.

Always use one size larger tap drill for Ti. 1/16" is right.:gossip:

To save having to buy an oversize reamer for dowels you can substitute 1/8 pivot pins for dowels. The pivot pins are a slip fit in a 1/8 reamed hole. Any 1/8 pin stock can also be used.

Your bushing will probably be OK. If the lock is fit correctly it'll take up any play in the bushing fit.

By the way, tools are cheaper to buy at MSC, Enco, or other industrial supply houses than ordering them from knifemaker supply companies. Get their import tools.

ok don i got it all figured out now. i should have checked up on my self first. i have 2 sets of plans, one you sent me last time but i never got around to useing and then thought i lost, and the set you sent me this time. it turns out i found the old set and was useing those, i now have the new set which has all my questions answered. oops

if i drill 1/16 to tap the liners do i need to ream also or can i go straight to tapping?

Brett

Here is the 2nd Barlow linerlock just completed. It has carbon fiber bolsters & African Blackwood for handles. The 3rd photo is of the two together. Don , this one does not have the stop pin !
http://www.fototime.com/5CDE0609886406E/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/D8130F28D6F8A26/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/32503C65CB56B44/standard.jpg

Happy New Year to All !

Joe Sangster

ok don i got it all figured out now. i should have checked up on my self first. i have 2 sets of plans, one you sent me last time but i never got around to useing and then thought i lost, and the set you sent me this time. it turns out i found the old set and was useing those, i now have the new set which has all my questions answered. oops

if i drill 1/16 to tap the liners do i need to ream also or can i go straight to tapping?

Brett

No. The tapped holes don't need to be reamed.

Great work, Joe. :101


But the old barlows didn't have carbon fiber bolsters.;)

Seriously, it seems you have linerlocks down pat. Whoever gets them is very fortunate.

Keep it up, Joe.

Thanks , Don ! They didn't have carbon fiber bolsters or linerlocks , did they ?:fencing:
The carbon fiber bolsters sure make carrying a pocet knife a lot easier for those of us who don't wear suspenders !:D

:fencing: No, and they broke a lot of fingernails opening them, cut lots of fingers closing. But I still like the shape. You done good.

I agree & I want to thank you for graciously sharing your design with all of us & all the help offered & given to us skill-challenged new makers . Happy New Year ! Joe

Thank you, Joe.

You ain't no skill-challenged maker now.:101

well i got problem 148 solved now theres only 74 to go.
it turns out i do have a peice of precision ground steel here so i wont have to worry about getting some. i bought a peice of damascus a while ago so i guess this is the perfect oportunity to use it, yay.
brett

i finally got all my materialls ordered and don is helping me get all the tools so in a few weeks i will have all the stuff and there will be no more excuses i will have to produce a barlow. i cant wait, we hee.
we have had a few people post their results in this thread but where are the others.
joe sanger has posted 2 beautiful examples, and dons re bone is stunning, whats everyone else up to, dwane you said you would start afeter you cgristmas knives, cap how are you going, is alan working with you?
frank, i seem to remember mention of gold lip pearl for you daughter!

brett

Brett, I just ordered the plans and I am also ordering materials. Everything should be here in a couple weeks. I hope to get started soon. I will post some more as I get going.

OK,

I got some Ti sheets in, there's 2 total, one is .040 and the other is 0.042. I ordered some ceramic belts to cut them and they dont seem to have much spring to them, when I cut the lock how do I handle that part? Is there something special I need to do besides just cutting it?

Ed

OK,

I got some Ti sheets in, there's 2 total, one is .040 and the other is 0.042. I ordered some ceramic belts to cut them and they dont seem to have much spring to them, when I cut the lock how do I handle that part? Is there something special I need to do besides just cutting it?

Ed

I just put the spring side liner in a vise with the back edge of the cut at the top of the vise jaw and hit it carefully using a wooden dowel and a hammer. Bend it a little past the thickness of the blade, no more. If it's over bent it will stress the whole handle when the blade opens.

Hope that helps.:)

OK Don,

Finally started! Going to do a run of 10. Got the blades, bolsters, backspines and liners all cut out this afternoon. I can tell that by the end, my bandsaw blade was having a hard time. I went from soft material and progressively went until I got to the Ti for the liners. Now I'm ready to get to the grinder and get my lines cleaned up before I do the bevels on the blades.

Still need some more pins so hopfully they will come in as my flow happens.

Also got me the beginnings of a forge this morning. I'll put that in another post.

Watch out Don, I'm trying to catch you!

Bill

Well, son of a gun, Bill's with us!:101

You can't catch me. I'm done went and gone months ago!;)

Well, son of a gun, Bill's with us!:101

You can't catch me. I'm done went and gone months ago!;)

Wise man once said accuracy and precision over speed. :)

OK!

I started on the Ti sheets today, I have 2 scales cut and one hole drilled. I bought some ceramic 36 grit 4x36 belts :) and it goes thru this stuff like hot butter. I used a dremel fiberglass cutoff wheel to cut the base shapes then beltsanded it to shape. That belt is awsome and I would not want to get my hand on it by accident.

Ed

trust me a 36grit will remove skin dam fast, my most impresive scar was caused by a 36grit belt.

not only is bill getting to work he has already gone in to production, a run of ten gee wiz, i'll be happy to get one done. I take it its not your first liner lock bill.

my first one is planned for some faux tortoise shell i have had for a while, but i received some elk horn yesterday and i think i will have to make a second and put the horn on it.

brett

Got all the parts ground down to the lines. Used 2+ 36 belts and even then could have used more for the Ti. Got the pivot holes drilled and reamed. Now ready to profile the bevels and do some work on the liners tommorrow.

I've got a couple different pieces of damascus for 3 sets of bolsters along with NS for the rest (oh one carbon fiber one too).

Question Don, Even after I reamed with my .1875 reamer, the 3/16 bushings have to be tapped in. That makes them too small for the pivot pin until it's reamed for .125. Your drawing says SF but does that mean I should be able to move it around with my finger pressure? The pivot still rotates regardless right?

Brett, I made one of Don's barlows last year, took almost a year before I finished it but I was able to sell it to our biggest gun store in town. Also made a frame lock off his notes too.

Bill

Got all the parts ground down to the lines. Used 2+ 36 belts and even then could have used more for the Ti. Got the pivot holes drilled and reamed. Now ready to profile the bevels and do some work on the liners tommorrow.

I've got a couple different pieces of damascus for 3 sets of bolsters along with NS for the rest (oh one carbon fiber one too).

Question Don, Even after I reamed with my .1875 reamer, the 3/16 bushings have to be tapped in. That makes them too small for the pivot pin until it's reamed for .125. Your drawing says SF but does that mean I should be able to move it around with my finger pressure? The pivot still rotates regardless right?

Brett, I made one of Don's barlows last year, took almost a year before I finished it but I was able to sell it to our biggest gun store in town. Also made a frame lock off his notes too.

Bill

Your bushing must be oversized Bill. Try putting it on a 1/8 pivot pin or dowel, put a screw into the pivot and put the other end into a hand drill chuck. Tap the bushing up tight against the chuck jaws, sand it, then turn it around and sand again until it's a slip fit.

Do you have a micrometer or dial caliper to measure it with?

The bushing is squeezed between the liners so the blade must rotate on the bushing O.D.

Where's my part of the money you made with the first barlow?:gossip: :D

Wise man once said accuracy and precision over speed. :)

What did this wise man have to say about a combination of accuracy, precision and speed?:p

Used 2+ 36 belts and even then could have used more for the Ti.
Bill

Did I read that right? you had to use 2x 36grit belts? What type of belts is this? Also what grade Ti? The stuff I bought is 6-4 and the ceramic 36 grit belt. It cut the Ti sheet like it was butter and so far no sign of wear on the belt.

Ed

Just a reminder- Use only 6AL/4V ti for knives. The other grades don't make good springs and don't anodize well.

Ed, I think they're 3M hoggers? Orange color. Remember I had already profiled 10 blades, 10 backspines, 20 bolsters and then 20 liners of Ti. With a new belt, yes it will cut like butter but after you do about 4-5 liners you start to notice that the Ti will turn red and start to roll down the backside leaving a very hard ridge that also has to be ground off.

Don, today was pretty productive as well. I decided to flat grind 5 and hollow grind 5. So today I flat ground 5 and went down to about 320 grit. Did my lock angle at 7 degrees. Yes they're facing the right way too!

Drilled and reamed the pivot and other two holes in the liner. I used a liner with the picture pasted on it and used that as a template. After I drilled a pilot hole, I drilled a .120 in all the pivot holes. Then I reamed all the pivot holes. Then I put a pivot pin in that hole and drilled the opposite end hole. I was drilling through both liners (two) at once and am keeping them as matched sets. After all those holes were drilled, I went back through and reamed them all. Then same procedure for the middle hole. So when I get ready, both sides should line up very well.

I started drilling the holes for the 1-72 x 6. The drawing says use a 1/16 drill but I remember that it was very hard to tap that way. I was thinking I need to use a 52 drill? Haven't re-read this post, it's probably in there.

Bill

finnaly the bulk of my stuff arived, i now have the Ti pivot pins screws bushes and all that other stuff, i now just have one package on the way with reamers and taps and i will have everything i need.
brett

hey don,
i just read through all your instructional posts and i was wondering. you mention that your tooling plate has a hole to match the pivot so you mount the blade liners and backspacer and then you drill for the dowels.
does this mean that the tooling plate is just a peice of flat metal with a 1/8 hole in it and then once the other holes are drilled its used to keep everything aligned.
can i use any metal? mild steel?

brett

finnaly the bulk of my stuff arived, i now have the Ti pivot pins screws bushes and all that other stuff, i now just have one package on the way with reamers and taps and i will have everything i need.
brett

You should get that package early next week, Brett.

hey don,
i just read through all your instructional posts and i was wondering. you mention that your tooling plate has a hole to match the pivot so you mount the blade liners and backspacer and then you drill for the dowels.
does this mean that the tooling plate is just a peice of flat metal with a 1/8 hole in it and then once the other holes are drilled its used to keep everything aligned.
can i use any metal? mild steel?

brett

Yes, any piece of flat metal. I make a hole the same size as the pivot pins, lay the parts on the plate with a pin thru the pivot holes, then I drill all the other holes thru the stack of parts and thru the plate. I build all my folding knives on a plate like that.

thanks to a package that just arived from don i now have everything i need to make this knife acept cutting fluid and i will buy that tomorow, i do have to help my mum out in the morning but hopefully that wont t6ake to long and i can get to work in the afternoon.
I am hopeing to get as much work as posible done before the weekend because on monday i start a new job that will take me from 2 days of work per week to 6 so i wont have to much knife making time. i think i will be spending my one day of recovering from the other 6 but hopefully i will have enough money now to not feel guilty about all the knife purchases i've made recently.
so if all goes to plan i will have a WIP ready tomorow.

one last question, is tapping fluid and cutting fluid the same thing or do i need to buy them both?

brett

I use tapping fluid for both.

I still need a few things myself to get started and will be ordering them this week.

well, i managed to find tapmagic in a store nearby so i have that all sorted, but unfortunately the couple of hours helping out my mum this morning turned in to most of the day so i didnt get started, im planning an early morning though and hopefully i can get the knife mostly made in the next 3 days. i have also found some batteries so should be able to get a few pics. if i take enough i might even start a new thread.

Brett

heeeeeeelp
i started working on the barlow early today and have reached a snag, it seems the bushings i bought are to small for the thickness of the blade, they dont go all the way through, so i have a choice, should i hand sand the blade and backspacer down to match the bushing(about 2mm) or should i make the bushing even smaller and use 2 of them? useing 2 bushings would be less effort but will it work?
brett

heeeeeeelp
i started working on the barlow early today and have reached a snag, it seems the bushings i bought are to small for the thickness of the blade, they dont go all the way through, so i have a choice, should i hand sand the blade and backspacer down to match the bushing(about 2mm) or should i make the bushing even smaller and use 2 of them? useing 2 bushings would be less effort but will it work?
brett

You have at least 2 choices Brett.

1. Use the 2 bushings

2. Use one bushing and then use Loc-tite thread bonder to adjust the screws to allow the blade to swivel.

Ive put my first WIP pics here http://knifenetwork.com/forum/showthread.php?p=298252#post298252 i decided to put them in another post because i figured people who arent watching this thread might see them and get inspired to pay more attention to the folding forum.

i decided to use 2 don because i wasnt quite sure what your other sugestion meant and it seeems to be working fine.

do you think i could file the lock up area on the tang instead of useing a disk sander? the only disk i have is on the side of my multi tool and the edge isnt very good so im not sure how well it will work. The number one problem i can see with filling it is trying to get the right angle, which i think i read is about 7deg.


brett

also to double check, a right handed person has a lock on the right liner?
and how do i install the detent ball? i have read all about its placement and corect hole size but how do i stick it in the hole?
brett

also to double check, a right handed person has a lock on the right liner?
and how do i install the detent ball? i have read all about its placement and corect hole size but how do i stick it in the hole?
brett

Correct on the right side liner.

Just tap the ball into the hole with a brass hammer. It should stick up the thickness of one washer.

Yes, you can file the lock notch.

aaahh bugger,
i think i need to make a new blade, while drilling the detent hole in the blade the drill bit snapped and then while trying to get it out the hole got out of alignment so now when the detent ball sucks in to the blade, it makes it hang about a 1/2 inch open. as far as i can tell there is no way to fix this other than making a whole new blade, whick is a killer because that means i will have wasted my first ever peice of damacus, although i do have enough left over for bolsters.
any solutions or do i have to scrap it?

brett

You don't have enough room for a second hole?

Before you scrap it, try denting one side of the hole with a center punch to "move" the hole over.

Too bad, you have to be very careful when drilling the detent hole.

You might also consider getting someone to weld up the hole.

tried to drill a new hole but it was too close to the old one, and to far away to move it over. i spent this morning making a new blade and fiting it up, it locks beter as well and now the detent is perfect.
brett

Good deal, Brett. You're well on the way.

All right, you lazy guys.:rolleyes:

It's been almost 3 months since we started this project. Is anyone else doing any work?

If so, let's see it!:D

Don, I am still waiting on some material. Hopefully it will be here this week. Then I can get started as soon as I get some free time.

Hey Don,

Got five blades back from HT'g over at Wally's. Spent the last two days trying to get the finish where I want it. Seems like even with the belts to 400, I still had scratches that took thirty minutes to get out. Probably averaged over two hours per blade. Even with grey rouge and a sisal wheel they wouldn't come out. Lots of hand sanding. I just got some new belts in this afternoon so maybe that will help on the next set.

Anyway, I took one blade and fit it to the liner with the pivot and bushings. My challenge now is that my back spine is .131. My blade is .093 and the only washers I have that fit the OD of the bushing is .011. So I'm about .006 over at the pivot area. Don't have a surface grinder so I'm scared to take that much off of the back spine with a disk sander or my KMG. Anyway to do that and still keep everything parallel?

Might have to break down and order some more washers.

Rmemeber Don, I bought a piece of 1/8 SS rod at the hammer-in for my dowel pins? Well it turns out that it was .156. So I used some brass rod I had laying around. Since it's only for alignment, that should be OK, right?

P.S. Don - did you see the photo that Johnny took for me? It's over on the display case.

Bill

Edited into Bill's post by mistake. I thought I was quoting him.:eek:

Get yourself some .018 to .020 brass shim stock from an automotive store or from Enco and make the washers yourself. Place the shim stock between 2 boards and drill the I.D., then trim the O.D. with scissors.

1/8 brass pins will work fine as dowels. Use pins as close to 1/8 as possible.

You'll always need to hand sand blades after heat treat. I grind the blade to 220 or 320 grit, heat treat, go back to 220 on the belt grinder to clean it up all over, then hand sand. 220, 400, 800, 1500, 2000 grits. And yes, that takes at least an hour, probably two to get the hand rubbed finish. Use water as a lubricant and wet or dry silicon carbide paper from the auto store.

I'll see your knife in a few minutes.

don you just made the most confusing post i have ever read. did you edit your answer in to the bottom of bills post? for a moment i thought bill had split personalitioes and was answering his own questions.

finally i have got a day off weork to work on the barlow, i worked my arse off this week and the boss said there is allot more to come, bugger. i laft home at 6.45 yesterday and got home at 22.00 this is a bloody killer. luckily the place i work on sat and sun has had an accident with their aircraft so i dont have to go in tommorow either so i will get 2 dasys off this week.

anyhoo i might go get to work so that i have something to show you all this evening.
brett

Yep, evidently I edited Bill's post instead of quoting him.

And Bill, I did see your knife. Very nice, original work.:101

OK, yesterday I broke one of my backspines so now I'm working on 3. Today I cut the locks in all three but have not done anything else on them after that. I was also wokring on a bigger folder and ran into a little challenge yall may be able to shed some light on.

I scribed the liner with the blade in the full open position, and then I set my cut off disk just to the top side of the line (pivot side). After I made my cut, I could still see my scribed line. However, the linerlock has about a paper thickness gap between it and the blade. So, if the lock is just barely engaged, we have a small amount of blade wobble up and down. What I attempted to do was to hammer the last 1/4 inch of the locking portion to see if I could expand it a small amount. It looks like that worked and with both liners installed, it locks up good. But when you snap it open with a little force the liner moves all the way to the right side of the blade.

I'm thinking I may need to use a punch and expand it some more, or maybe reduce the amount of tension I have on the spring so it wouln't move naturally. Have yall ever fixed this before?

I guess on the next ones I will make it longer for sure and then file it down to fit. Hopefully the barlows will be OK.

Bill

bill, i'm not the right one to answer this maybe, but i think only way to fix this problem is a new liner...sorry to say thaht, when i was starting, i made this mistake many times, and after so many trials to fix it, i figured out this: if you'll try to somehow fix the inproperly fitted liner, it'll only make you problems and you won't be satisfied with your work...i think it's not so much work to make a new liner, is it? maybe an hour of work, but well worth

papiknives czech republic - Ondrej Berkus

i would have to agree with papi, usually its easier just to start agin than try and fix a mistake and only end up with a second rate job.

brett

Thanks Papi and Brett.

Here's what I did. I took some of the bend out, it was about 1 1/2 times the open space so I was a little too aggressive on that. Then, I took a punch and rounded the tip, then beat the last 1/4 inch of the lock. Then with a flat punch, beat on it some more. Remeber, I only needed it to move about .003. When I got through, I had to use the belt sander (1x42) to get it to lock. It now locks at the first 1/4 of the blade!!

I used a torch to anodize the liners and the heat actually expanded it a little too, I had to re-file just a hair.

Now that I've finished that folder, I'll be at the barlows again. Should have them ready in a few days.

Question for Don or any of you who are trying to make a living at this. I'm keeping track of my time real close on a run of the barlows. I know I save time by doing multiple holes with each drill bit etc. However, I'm finding it hard to keep track of which bit is used for which hole. It seems I have to measure everytime and calculate which size I need for a particluar hole. Does it need to be tapped, slip fit or countersunk, etc (I know the dwg shows this, but I'm using 2-56 in some spots). Then, my bits don't end up in the index ... Do you have multiple drill presses, or multiple bits of the same size in a bottle, how do you organize this flow?

Bill

not trying to make a livingf but i have a list of what bits for what jobs that i keep in my pocket then i have to make sure i put the bits back in their numbered bags, so i know which is which.

brett.

There's a rule I used to teach my apprentices, Bill. "Clean as you go." That means that you always put a tool back in it's place as soon as you get thru with it. If you put the drill back into it's index it saves time over measuring and trying to figure out what size it is later.

I'm glad you salvaged the liner.

OK, finally finished the first one. Now I've got some questions about Tiger Coral. I used a nice piece and had eveything shaped up and then noticed little holes like pores all over the surface. I used nickle silver for the bolsters and sanded it all togeher. Then of course I had to buff it a little to see if it would get shiney. So then I had what looked like blackheads on my scales. I used acetone and a toothbrush to get as much as I could off. Then I put a coat of polyureothene on it to help seal the scales.

What should I have done and is the red coral going to be the same as this piece of tiger?

Bill

I've never used coral, so i can't help much.

Since it's mineral it can be expected to have some voids and fissures. Buffing fills the voids with black. My advise is to clean with soap and water using a toothbrush as you said, then make some fine sanding dust from a piece of scrap. Fill the voids with sanding dust, then put a drop of the thinnest super glue on top of the dust. Sand the scales with fine sandpaper before the drop of super glue sets, which will help fill them.

When buffing a handle, buff the bolsters away from the scale, not toward the scales.

What is the best way to thin down the material besides a surface grinder? My blade material is a little thicker than I want I was thinking about just grinding it flat on the platen. I need to take about .020 off

What is the best way to thin down the material besides a surface grinder? My blade material is a little thicker than I want I was thinking about just grinding it flat on the platen. I need to take about .020 off

Man, that's going to be a chore, Doc. If you have a disc grinder use that.

Otherwise, the flat platen will do. Use a piece of masking tape folded to make a tab handle and stick it on the back side.

Is anybody else finished with your knife?

Who has finished?

Who's working?

Who's loafing?:eek: :doubleenf

Is anybody else finished with your knife?

Who has finished?

Who's working?

Who's loafing?:eek: :doubleenf

Still not finished:banghead Very busy this weekend had to work again:mad:

Definitely not loafing. I envy you guys with all that time to work:bow

I got my plans , and got all of my supplies in , thanks Don. I'll be a slow starter as I have nine knives to finish before Christmas. When I get those done I'll start on this project , I hope you can wait that long.

Dwane

All right now, Dwane. Get to work and show us something.:eek: No, not that thing. I meant your barlow.:)

OK Don.

Got one done with tiger coral scales, and another one almost finished with mammoth tooh with mop inlays. Still have to get the washers adjusted for that one and put my name on it. My stencil looks like it has little tiny hair like lines around the letters, so I haven't figured out what to do about it yet.

In the mean time, I've finished another fixed blade with Thuya burl and carving on the blade. Also working on my combat kith knife (from last year), it's a semi khukri so I've been trying to incorporate some of the things we learned at the hammer-in last month. Oh yeah, also made about six training knives for my brother's martial arts class.

I haven't seen the latest dwg but my Barlow bolsters are coming out barely long enough to get the front screw in. I'm using a hidden pivot screw so I added one on the end. I think I'll extend it out a little more on the next batch. OR, use the pivot as the front screw. But on my dwg, the pivot is off center, so I don't know if I like that either. I know, I know, come up with my own design...

I wasnt' too happy with the mammoth tooth either, it was very difficult to drill and that's was caused me to have to add some mop inlays. There's lines in there that the drill bit just slides around on. It also has a tendency to chip so what should I do about chips that are around the holes, and also one on the back edge? Should I grind some more and mix the dust with epoxy or is there a more accepted way? Or leave them open?

Bill

The design doesn't leave much room ahead of the pivot, but it works. You can leave the liners and bolsters a little longer if you wish.

I've never used mammoth tooth. But don't use epoxy to fill holes. use cyanoacrylate (super glue) with the dust.

Epoxy doesn't dry clear like super glue.

By the way, the pivot has to be off center.:)

Thank You Don, I'll try that this morning.

Bill

Sorry Don , paying customers come first. I really dont see me finishing this project anytime soon. I'm about 10 behind , thats alot for a hobbiest maker. Cut me off the list.

Thanks
Dwane

im just waiting till i get the chance to go shopping for the drill bit i need to countersink the screws.
brett

Brett,

There's a tool maker from texas on this forum who recently made me some excellent step drills for that very same purpose. He's also way cheaper than the catalogs and can custom cut whatever size you want.

Ed

Hi, Ed.

Have you ever clicked on the second link below my signature?;)

I just finished another of Don's little Barlows -- Damascus bolsters & MOP handles. I think it is the prettiest one I've done yet ! Thanks for looking. Joe
http://www.fototime.com/F79E27BFE42F0DB/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/1A4CCC4A378AC09/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/E3E6C25CD2F1772/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/FD8704190717AD4/standard.jpg

Now that, my friends, is a really fine example of a linerlock barlow. :D

I love the way you finished the inside, Joe.

Man, I'm really proud of you!:gossip:

Frank Niro, if you're around, take a look at this one!

Thanks for making a great start to my day, Joe.

very nice!

looks stuning joe, i love the contrast between the dark bolsters and the pright pearl. truelly outstanding.
brett

Don , you also made my day ! MM & Brett , thanks also to you for your favorable comments !
Cheers,
Joe